Pro Wrestling Forever Ep. 02

May 6

Stables, Factions, and everything between

For decades, pro wrestling factions and stables have been one of the most powerful storytelling tools in the history of the business. Whether it was groups dominating territories, changing the direction of major promotions, or simply creating unforgettable chaos, factions have helped define entire eras of wrestling fandom. On the latest episode of Pro Wrestling Forever, Professor Degree and Blade Daily dive deep into the greatest wrestling factions of all time, exploring the legendary groups that felt larger than life alongside the bizarre experiments that completely fell apart. From AEW and New Japan Pro Wrestling to WCW, WWF, ECW, and beyond, the conversation covers wrestling history, vintage wrestling nostalgia, credibility, overexposure, and the strange magic that only pro wrestling can create.

The fellas also tackle some of the toughest questions wrestling fans love to argue about: Which factions ended at exactly the right moment? Which groups stayed together long after the magic disappeared? And which one member completely destroyed the credibility of an otherwise great stable? Along the way, the episode celebrates the contradictions that make pro wrestling so compelling—equal parts athletic competition, theater, community, absurdity, and art. Whether you love dominant supergroups, chaotic heel collectives, or forgotten cult favorites, this episode of Pro Wrestling Forever is packed with deep-cut wrestling discussion, passionate debate, and appreciation for the factions that shaped wrestling across generations.

Listen absolutely anywhere!

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Hello, wrestling fans.
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I'm your host, the toast of the third coast, Professor Degree, with me as always, Blayde
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Daly.
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How are you doing today, Blayde?
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I'm doing...
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Shut up.
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I gotta...
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Can I tell the title?
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Can I tell the name of the show?
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Fine.
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This is Pro Wrestling Forever.
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This is my co-host, I, Blayde Daly.
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Blayde, how are you doing today?
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I'm doing great.
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Now can you shut up?
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Yeah.
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Okay, great.
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Because I want you guys to make sure that if you're not already, that you fucking go
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to the YouTube, that you're on our YouTube channel, and you fucking go and you smash
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that subscribe button, you smash that thumbs up button wherever the fuck you see it,
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okay?
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You leave a comment, not just in the live chat, after we post it, you come back,
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you leave another comment, okay?
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Because they're different things.
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They're not the same.
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And then, you go find us on your favorite podcast network, and you fucking subscribe to it
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there too.
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Then you leave us a five-star review, and you know what you get?
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The satisfaction of knowing you did it.
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I'm doing good.
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Yeah, right.
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Hey, thanks for showing up.
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It's Tuesday.
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We're a day late and a dollar short, but neither one of us had to take a 50%
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pay cut to get here.
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That's right.
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Hey, because we don't make any money.
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Today, our topic is factions, families, stables, teams, whatever you want to call it.
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Webster's Dictionary defines a stable as a group of wrestlers connected under a common
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theme, usually with a mouthpiece, such as a manager or a valet, whereas a faction
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is usually a group of peers with similar gimmicks that have a mission statement.
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Give or take.
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And it doesn't really matter because it's professional wrestling, so we can just make
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up whatever the fuck history we want, and you have to accept it.
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It's our show.
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Yeah.
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Get your own part.
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Basically, when I looked it up, the internet just told me, fuck you, nerd.
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So basically, a stable is manager-led or leader-driven, right?
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It's structured, semi-permanent.
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So there's the Four Horsemen, actually, the very first version of the Four Horsemen,
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considered the modern-day template for factions, was actually a stable.
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Because of their manager and financial advisor, James J.
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Dillon.
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Exactly.
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And the structure, you know, Ric Flair's at the top, then he always has that
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hotshot who's like the US title guy, and then he's got a tag team, you know?
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Whereas a faction is more about a unified ideology or cause, members aligned around
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maybe a mission, an invasion or a power grab, something like that, often more
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story-driven than structural.
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It can be temporary or explosive.
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You did sound smart when you said that, Blade.
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Well, I'm learning to read and it's cool.
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That's why I keep you around, little buddy.
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Reading's good.
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Yeah, so the Four Horsemen, probably not the first stable, but as we've
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discussed in the past, look, the Beatles didn't invent rock and roll, Stan Lee and
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Jack Kirby didn't invent comic books, but they pretty much broke new ground and
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everybody since then has imitated them.
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And the Horsemen are kind of the ones that everybody imitates, but they're not
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the first, Blade.
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Not even close.
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Not even close.
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Thank you, Chattalack Margarita.
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So going back to-
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I'm your professor, but you're kind of like Mike Tanay.
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Thanks.
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Thanks.
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I think that's a compliment.
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Like Mike Tanay.
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He has, you know, Mike Tanay, Mike Tanay was good.
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He was he's he does that like whiny, like a weird face when he gets super pissed.
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But I like like I learned more about Lucha from Mike Tanay than, you know,
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I mean, at that point, anyone, you know, I mean, I feel like the
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Mike Tanay loved the wrestling business more than the wrestling business
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loved Mike Tanay, and he was not treated very well at a lot of different junctures.
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And that's why I treat you like shit, Blade.
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Thanks, man.
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So first stable.
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Well, so first stable is pretty much impossible.
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OK, what we can do is go back to the very early days of the territories, right?
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30s, 40s, 50s, you have tag teams, right?
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You have managers who maybe manage multiple people, right?
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Multiple singles guys in a tag team, but they're not really running
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interference and doing all that stuff yet.
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Then in the 60s, you start to see a little more of that, a little more, right?
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Gary Hart goes from being a wrestler to being a manager,
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because Gary Hart was around in the 60s.
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Gary Hart was wrestling in the 50s, bro.
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Jesus Christ. Yeah, he's old.
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He was old in the 80s.
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I guess I just didn't really put it all together.
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Well, and he was hip as fuck.
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It was the other part of it.
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He's like, what it is.
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Anyway, he's cool as fuck.
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Gary Hart was cool.
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So he he's managed, you know,
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starting to kind of put together some architecture there.
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Then the Grand Wizard in WWF, WWWF,
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1971 unfortunate name, he kind of starts developing
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the manager template of a stable where he's managing a bunch of guys.
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But in 74, this little known guy named Bobby the Brain, Heenan.
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Never heard of him in the AWA forms
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the first incarnation of the Heenan family.
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And it was Nick Bachwinkle.
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Ray Stevens, Crippler Ray Stevens, Bobby Duncan,
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senior and Blackjack, Blackjack,
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Blackjack Lanza. Yeah.
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One no sign out what the grand the Grand Wizard blade.
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He was Jewish.
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Grand Wizard was a gay Jewish man, and he chose that name as a fuck
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you to the other person who was called the Grand Wizard.
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Yes, yes.
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So that's pretty cool.
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Yes. Very cool. Very cool.
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Ernie Roth, RIP, baby.
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Yeah. But yeah.
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So around the mid 70s is when the modern manager stable starts.
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But if you really want to dig in to like factions,
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like find the first faction, if it's a shared ideology,
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if chaos is an ideology.
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I think you go Kevin Sullivan's army.
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In Florida with a satanic panic.
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Yes, this is prior to the horsemen, right?
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Yeah, to the horsemen.
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So really, yeah, because he did have like kind of a whole magical
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team of deviants.
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He did get Bob Roop.
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Yeah. Who shaved half his fucking head.
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You know, I mean, I grew up as Mackenzie or something like that.
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Markham Singh was Norman the lunatic in Stampede, but I hear you.
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I hear you.
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No, it it it it's a wild stable.
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I mean, really, really wild.
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He has the what was Nancy Sullivan's name?
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Angel, the dark fallen angel, fallen angel.
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Yes, fallen angel.
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Bob Rube, Abudadeen, Abudadeen.
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Yes, Abudadeen, the purple haze.
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Mark Lewin was also and he was from the deepest,
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darkest depths of the ocean.
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Right. Right. Right.
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Literally came out of the ocean.
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He summoned him.
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So basically, what you're saying is that your first stable was like
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the satanic panic scare of the 80s.
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Yeah. Yeah.
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And then by and the fact that Bobby Heenan is pretty much
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been laying the template since the 70s, which is insane.
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Well, and he just takes that Heenan family concept
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and keeps building on it and then takes it to WWF when he goes there.
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Another guy who took a similar concept to WWF,
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they will call it the first family, but it's actually not the first family,
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is Jimmy Hart.
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So Jimmy Hart in Memphis, we're going to quickly,
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you know, do a little education here.
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Look at this.
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Yeah. Sure. We're living in it.
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So it's set up on the wrong thing.
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That's another thing that I will discuss and disparage later.
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But in Memphis,
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Jimmy Hart starts the first family because Jerry Lawler was his protege.
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And they were both baby faces.
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And then Jerry gets hurt.
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And Jimmy goes, well, I can't make money off him anymore, baby.
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So he goes and recruits an entire stable to destroy Jerry Lawler.
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Look at the amount of people this man had as a stable.
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In like five years in Memphis,
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Norvell Austin, Ox Baker,
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King Kong Bundy, Dennis Condrey, Sabu the Wild Man, not that Sabu,
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Chick Donovan, Bobby Eaton, Wayne Ferris, Buddy Landell, Austin,
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Idle, Masao, Ito, Kamala, Andy Kaufman.
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I don't think that that is the picture that I'm seeing on my screen.
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It's not.
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No, I'm seeing a thing that says members.
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Aaron Anderson, Billy Kidman.
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Oh, no. OK, hold on.
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Hold on. I'll switch it. Shut up.
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I'll switch it. Just stop talking. Jesus.
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You you were my embarrassment will subside if you stop talking.
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This planet for just a minute.
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I know you're working on that.
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I'm going to point out something. Yeah, so.
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Heenan has a family and their family and their stable
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because he's the manager, but they have a purpose,
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which is usually for a faction and the purpose is to take out Hulk Hogan.
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And what you're talking about here is that Jimmy Hart has a purpose
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and the purpose is to take out.
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Lawler, so it's kind of like
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Jimmy Hart is kind of like a faction.
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And if you watch early Memphis, these guys are running interference
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for each other constantly.
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I mean, just running in, assaulting people just randomly.
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And people are coming in and out constantly.
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So Coco, where Coco, where? Yep.
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Lanny Poffo, Randy Savage, Jim Neidhart, Jim Neidhart,
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Iron Sheik.
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We're all learning something today.
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Yeah, yeah.
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The original the original Brews Brothers.
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Look at that pork chop.
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Cash normal circumstances.
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They might not have been friends.
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They might not have been buddies, but they are united
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under the cause of destroying Jerry Lawler.
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Yes, which I think a lot of us are actually.
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Yeah, I was actually in retrospect.
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They were the baby faces when you think about it.
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They were trying to protect a lot of people out there.
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Randy Savage, Eddie Gilbert, Tommy Rich, a whole lot of people.
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It's like that's like a.
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I mean, it's like a Hall of Fame class, basically.
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Yeah, that's insane.
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And all those people came in and out in like
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a four or five years, you know.
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So we asked in the chat who your greatest faction ever was
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and who is the weak link that killed one.
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So we'll we'll read a few of those right now.
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Antoine in the chat. What's up, my friend?
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Good, good brother. Good to have you with us.
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Greatest faction ever.
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I will go with the faction that lasted the longest,
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barely over L.I.J., which, wow, Antoine saying anything's over
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L.I.J. is crazy. The Bullet Club.
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Their impact is across so many promotions, wrestlers,
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careers and look at the impact. Absolutely.
238
00:11:42.980 --> 00:11:45.060
Yeah, at this point. Absolutely.
239
00:11:45.660 --> 00:11:46.600
Oh, yeah. Everybody.
240
00:11:47.240 --> 00:11:48.540
Yeah, that's that's another.
241
00:11:48.700 --> 00:11:52.280
I mean, it's like it's like a horseman or, you know, what have you,
242
00:11:52.320 --> 00:11:56.820
where it's just like all these top tier a list stars, right?
243
00:11:56.820 --> 00:11:57.660
Oh, we got a little more.
244
00:11:57.940 --> 00:12:01.240
And the person I think that is responsible for killing the Bullet Club, Gato.
245
00:12:01.700 --> 00:12:05.960
He should have never, ever put David Finley as lead of the Bullet Club.
246
00:12:05.960 --> 00:12:09.220
I mean, true, true. It's hard to dispute that.
247
00:12:09.960 --> 00:12:11.820
He just didn't have the charisma to carry it.
248
00:12:11.820 --> 00:12:13.840
Look, it's a hard thing to follow.
249
00:12:14.360 --> 00:12:17.560
Finn Baller or sorry, Prince Devitt, A.J.
250
00:12:17.680 --> 00:12:19.420
Stiles, Kenny Omega, Jay White.
251
00:12:19.560 --> 00:12:21.380
That's a pretty fucking tall order.
252
00:12:22.020 --> 00:12:23.060
Yeah, I mean, at that point,
253
00:12:23.800 --> 00:12:26.000
it's probably just time to shutter the doors anyway.
254
00:12:26.000 --> 00:12:28.700
I don't like move on, you know,
255
00:12:29.020 --> 00:12:31.020
but the Bullet Club is kind of hard to deny.
256
00:12:31.020 --> 00:12:34.980
I mean, at this in the old days, you'd always say the horsemen,
257
00:12:34.980 --> 00:12:36.720
you'd always say the NWO later on.
258
00:12:36.860 --> 00:12:41.240
But like the Bullet Club is kind of like outshadowed all of that stuff.
259
00:12:41.480 --> 00:12:43.380
I mean, I remember going to Ring of Honor shows
260
00:12:43.380 --> 00:12:47.160
and like three quarters of the crowd were wearing fucking Bullet Club shirts,
261
00:12:47.220 --> 00:12:51.740
even in the early days of A.W., even still, you see Bullet Club T-shirts.
262
00:12:52.840 --> 00:12:57.640
It lasted way longer than anybody could have ever dreamed that it would.
263
00:12:58.440 --> 00:13:02.120
Oh, blurry line says like the shield really hard to beat
264
00:13:02.120 --> 00:13:04.180
in terms of how good their matches were as a group,
265
00:13:04.180 --> 00:13:06.720
combined with the fact that there was zero dud members
266
00:13:06.720 --> 00:13:08.820
all became multi-time world champions.
267
00:13:09.860 --> 00:13:11.380
You know what, Blair line, I agree.
268
00:13:11.560 --> 00:13:13.640
I think the shield is one of the greatest of all time.
269
00:13:13.940 --> 00:13:15.820
They are a three man
270
00:13:18.120 --> 00:13:19.020
blackson, right?
271
00:13:19.180 --> 00:13:20.280
So like
272
00:13:23.760 --> 00:13:27.060
three men make a stable or a faction three men.
273
00:13:27.480 --> 00:13:29.620
They were weren't they Seaham Punks goons in the morning.
274
00:13:29.700 --> 00:13:32.160
They were originally Seaham Punks goons. Yes. Yeah.
275
00:13:32.160 --> 00:13:36.240
So, I mean, initially, it's kind of stable-esque and then turns into a faction.
276
00:13:36.580 --> 00:13:41.460
What I would say, and John Moxley, you can thank him for giving them the gift of this,
277
00:13:41.600 --> 00:13:43.360
is they can't go back to it.
278
00:13:43.940 --> 00:13:46.480
So they can never restore it.
279
00:13:46.500 --> 00:13:50.660
So they can either try to do it with different people, which would suck.
280
00:13:51.620 --> 00:13:56.140
And every time they've kind of hinted at it or trying to do it again, they briefly
281
00:13:56.140 --> 00:13:57.940
reunited before Mox left.
282
00:13:58.620 --> 00:14:01.220
And then one of them kept getting hurt.
283
00:14:01.220 --> 00:14:03.540
So none of them were together all at once.
284
00:14:03.920 --> 00:14:04.180
Right.
285
00:14:05.120 --> 00:14:08.060
And the gift is that we never got too much of the shield.
286
00:14:08.420 --> 00:14:09.780
And I think that that's a big deal.
287
00:14:09.940 --> 00:14:14.920
I think that that really ended up helping their legacy because it was these
288
00:14:14.920 --> 00:14:19.340
three guys who all became world heavyweight champions, just like Larry said.
289
00:14:20.120 --> 00:14:21.560
You didn't have a chance to get sick of them.
290
00:14:21.560 --> 00:14:21.900
Right.
291
00:14:22.280 --> 00:14:24.500
You know, you never got tired and they never replaced a member.
292
00:14:24.660 --> 00:14:27.940
They never, yeah, like, I mean, that's the perfect way to say it.
293
00:14:27.940 --> 00:14:30.100
It was so short that.
294
00:14:31.240 --> 00:14:34.100
It's it's always going to be on this higher up pedestal.
295
00:14:34.380 --> 00:14:35.060
That's a good answer.
296
00:14:35.220 --> 00:14:36.760
That's probably one I would have not given.
297
00:14:37.640 --> 00:14:40.700
So, yep, there's a good one from Skewered Universe.
298
00:14:41.340 --> 00:14:42.800
Skewered Universe, let's see.
299
00:14:43.360 --> 00:14:46.700
Yeah, right. I knew about Bullet Club before I started watching New Japan.
300
00:14:47.040 --> 00:14:49.800
Exactly. You saw the t-shirts before you started.
301
00:14:50.820 --> 00:14:54.280
I knew what Bullet Club was long before I was like into New Japan.
302
00:14:54.480 --> 00:14:55.460
That's totally it.
303
00:14:55.460 --> 00:14:58.960
The table is where horses are kept and a faction that is exactly right.
304
00:14:59.040 --> 00:15:01.300
And that's what we're here to talk about is math.
305
00:15:01.620 --> 00:15:03.800
Yes, this is a podcast about math.
306
00:15:04.040 --> 00:15:06.200
Antoine, I want to pick L.I.J.
307
00:15:06.360 --> 00:15:10.080
or Los Ingobernables is my number one B and it's all Yota Tsuji's fault.
308
00:15:10.780 --> 00:15:13.320
I mean, he did bring death to them.
309
00:15:13.720 --> 00:15:14.940
You know, what can you say?
310
00:15:16.740 --> 00:15:18.880
The Heart Foundation, Scare Glow picks the Heart Foundation.
311
00:15:19.180 --> 00:15:22.060
Canadian American War era is my all time favorite faction.
312
00:15:22.580 --> 00:15:24.000
It might be mine, too.
313
00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:25.660
It's a favorite of the show.
314
00:15:25.920 --> 00:15:29.820
I mean, we've talked about it like they if they would have if they could have kept
315
00:15:29.820 --> 00:15:33.100
going for longer, they could have been one of the all time greats.
316
00:15:33.100 --> 00:15:36.240
Yeah, like they're kind of forgotten quickly,
317
00:15:36.240 --> 00:15:38.540
but they could have been bigger than they were.
318
00:15:38.800 --> 00:15:40.800
It's where the attitude era actually begins.
319
00:15:41.380 --> 00:15:42.260
Yes, yes.
320
00:15:42.340 --> 00:15:45.300
And I know it sounds weird to say Bret Hart could be on an even higher
321
00:15:45.300 --> 00:15:48.360
pedestal, but yeah, I mean, he could have, you know.
322
00:15:48.420 --> 00:15:49.660
Yeah, yeah.
323
00:15:51.040 --> 00:15:54.960
Blurry Line 7, we got a couple of Gold Rush Trio fans in the house.
324
00:15:55.040 --> 00:15:56.120
Gold Dust Trio.
325
00:15:56.600 --> 00:15:57.660
Yes. Right. Yes.
326
00:15:58.240 --> 00:16:00.420
Going back to Ed Lestrangler Lewis.
327
00:16:01.540 --> 00:16:02.480
Yeah. Yeah.
328
00:16:02.880 --> 00:16:04.020
Let's see. Let's see.
329
00:16:04.120 --> 00:16:07.060
Let's see. For the longest time.
330
00:16:07.300 --> 00:16:10.180
I mean, when I was a kid, I didn't see the four horsemen
331
00:16:10.180 --> 00:16:11.380
in their original incarnation.
332
00:16:11.980 --> 00:16:15.300
My version of the horsemen was the one on the trading cards
333
00:16:15.300 --> 00:16:20.360
where you had Flair, Arn, I think, Barry Windham and Sid,
334
00:16:20.720 --> 00:16:23.460
I think, were the team at the time when I first started watching.
335
00:16:23.580 --> 00:16:24.160
Yeah, me too.
336
00:16:25.560 --> 00:16:30.700
So that like I look at Oli and I'm not necessarily really a big fan.
337
00:16:31.780 --> 00:16:33.740
I like Barry Windham in that group.
338
00:16:33.940 --> 00:16:35.980
I like Arn and Tully as a tag team personally.
339
00:16:36.360 --> 00:16:38.420
Like the I guess it's the next incarnation.
340
00:16:38.560 --> 00:16:40.660
Maybe is Luger before Windham.
341
00:16:40.880 --> 00:16:44.340
Yeah. So well, then it's the incarnation after that.
342
00:16:44.340 --> 00:16:49.840
Well, so it's it's what it what it is is an eighty five.
343
00:16:50.660 --> 00:16:52.840
You know, these guys have already been running in the same circle
344
00:16:52.840 --> 00:16:53.740
a lot anyway.
345
00:16:54.940 --> 00:16:58.960
And Arne Anderson cuts that infamous promo on worldwide
346
00:16:58.960 --> 00:17:01.580
or whatever it was where he says, what you're looking at here
347
00:17:01.580 --> 00:17:03.200
is a four horsemen of the apocalypse.
348
00:17:03.780 --> 00:17:06.839
J.J. Dillon had been managing, you know, this like kind of
349
00:17:07.720 --> 00:17:11.040
evil guy pastiche of people, you know,
350
00:17:11.560 --> 00:17:16.339
see him managing like just the losers kind of who weren't all that great.
351
00:17:16.859 --> 00:17:19.380
Dillon always feels like a poor man's Bobby Heenan to me.
352
00:17:19.380 --> 00:17:21.920
And in some ways, he's not the same character,
353
00:17:21.920 --> 00:17:25.319
but just the the blonde hair, the suit and top kind of thing.
354
00:17:25.460 --> 00:17:27.280
Yeah. And I don't think he's trying to be Bobby at all.
355
00:17:27.319 --> 00:17:28.359
I don't think he is.
356
00:17:28.359 --> 00:17:30.800
I'm saying like as a kid, when I looked at him, it was like,
357
00:17:30.860 --> 00:17:33.180
well, who's this guy? He's not Heenan.
358
00:17:33.220 --> 00:17:37.000
So, yeah. So, you know, they are the ones who unite around Rick Flair
359
00:17:37.000 --> 00:17:38.440
as their world champion.
360
00:17:38.720 --> 00:17:40.920
None of them are as important as Rick Flair.
361
00:17:40.920 --> 00:17:43.900
They say that in the interviews all the time.
362
00:17:43.920 --> 00:17:46.780
You never heard that before. Right.
363
00:17:47.340 --> 00:17:50.980
And the four horsemen set that template of there's the leader,
364
00:17:51.160 --> 00:17:53.660
which is the Flair guy. Right.
365
00:17:53.880 --> 00:17:56.220
Then there's the secondary singles guy,
366
00:17:57.260 --> 00:18:01.340
which would be the Luger or the Wyndham or whoever. Right.
367
00:18:01.640 --> 00:18:03.300
Tully. Right.
368
00:18:03.660 --> 00:18:06.280
Because the Andersons were originally the tag team.
369
00:18:06.420 --> 00:18:08.880
And then Tully and Arne became the tag team and Luger
370
00:18:08.880 --> 00:18:11.200
became the secondary guy when Olie got kicked out.
371
00:18:11.740 --> 00:18:14.960
And Tully, when you look at old Tully interviews
372
00:18:15.560 --> 00:18:18.660
from, I guess, pre horsemen era, I get it.
373
00:18:18.660 --> 00:18:21.340
Like when they talk about that whole similar gimmick thing,
374
00:18:21.400 --> 00:18:24.840
he is kind of like a brown haired Rick Flair from,
375
00:18:25.060 --> 00:18:27.340
you know, a few states over. Right.
376
00:18:27.800 --> 00:18:30.140
That kind of hotshot pretty boy thing was going on.
377
00:18:30.200 --> 00:18:34.060
You know, I'm the best at what I do kind of a thing.
378
00:18:34.060 --> 00:18:35.540
So, yeah, it all made sense.
379
00:18:35.540 --> 00:18:37.140
And they did fit together really well.
380
00:18:37.140 --> 00:18:40.340
Olie never really quite made sense to me,
381
00:18:40.640 --> 00:18:42.340
but the Andersons were the Andersons.
382
00:18:42.400 --> 00:18:43.320
So I get it.
383
00:18:43.460 --> 00:18:45.700
Well, and Olie was Olie was running down,
384
00:18:45.700 --> 00:18:47.960
you know, the clock to the end of his career.
385
00:18:48.260 --> 00:18:51.300
And that it was a good place for him to land
386
00:18:51.300 --> 00:18:52.820
because he didn't have to work as hard.
387
00:18:53.640 --> 00:18:55.820
And, you know, he could be a guy who interfered
388
00:18:55.820 --> 00:18:58.020
and was just vicious, you know, more than.
389
00:18:58.420 --> 00:19:01.480
But he was moving into the backstage role more at the time.
390
00:19:01.480 --> 00:19:05.460
And I think that's a lot of what a faction does is you look at
391
00:19:05.460 --> 00:19:08.380
a lot of the take the death riders, for example.
392
00:19:08.960 --> 00:19:11.000
I don't know where Claudio
393
00:19:11.000 --> 00:19:13.360
would be without the death riders.
394
00:19:13.360 --> 00:19:16.840
He would be a mid card, dude, have an awesome matches.
395
00:19:17.760 --> 00:19:20.180
But in the death riders, he has a purpose, right?
396
00:19:20.180 --> 00:19:21.680
He's got he's got somewhere to go.
397
00:19:21.900 --> 00:19:24.100
And then you take, say, Daniel Garcia,
398
00:19:24.920 --> 00:19:28.200
or maybe Meryn Shafir would be even more so.
399
00:19:28.560 --> 00:19:29.740
This is an up and comer.
400
00:19:30.040 --> 00:19:30.440
You know what I mean?
401
00:19:30.480 --> 00:19:31.780
Wheeler, you does an up and comer.
402
00:19:32.000 --> 00:19:33.360
Pack is a guy that's already there.
403
00:19:33.360 --> 00:19:36.060
But again, he lost in the shuffle very easily.
404
00:19:36.080 --> 00:19:39.420
Right. Well, and he did quite frequently for a long time.
405
00:19:39.420 --> 00:19:40.160
He would get lost.
406
00:19:40.340 --> 00:19:42.880
Just a dude that has the best match on the show every night.
407
00:19:42.880 --> 00:19:45.780
But somehow that gets lost in the shuffle. Right.
408
00:19:46.640 --> 00:19:50.960
So putting these people together in a unit gives them something to do
409
00:19:50.960 --> 00:19:54.320
and allows them to, you know, they can avoid having shitty gimmicks
410
00:19:54.320 --> 00:19:56.960
or just being jobbers or whatever.
411
00:19:58.480 --> 00:20:02.080
You know, there's there's more to a unit than just the storyline.
412
00:20:02.080 --> 00:20:03.780
I guess 100 percent.
413
00:20:03.840 --> 00:20:06.260
Well, and like with the death riders, it's an ideology, right?
414
00:20:06.320 --> 00:20:10.020
They're here to toughen everybody up and kind of show them that, hey,
415
00:20:10.040 --> 00:20:13.920
this isn't just, you know, and now we have this fascinating thing
416
00:20:13.920 --> 00:20:19.080
going on with the death riders and the United Empire and the dogs
417
00:20:19.080 --> 00:20:22.880
and how all of their stories are going to collide and the Don
418
00:20:22.880 --> 00:20:26.400
Callis family, because you've got Andrade in the United Empire.
419
00:20:26.400 --> 00:20:29.900
And that's that's another beautiful thing about factions.
420
00:20:29.900 --> 00:20:32.620
And we'll get to this at the towards the end of the episode, but.
421
00:20:33.980 --> 00:20:37.200
It just gives you a million different matchups.
422
00:20:37.460 --> 00:20:38.300
You know what I mean?
423
00:20:39.200 --> 00:20:41.180
Antoine asked, does three make a faction?
424
00:20:41.460 --> 00:20:42.760
Yes, it does. I think so.
425
00:20:43.000 --> 00:20:46.660
It does. It's the smallest a faction can be, but it is a faction. Right.
426
00:20:46.900 --> 00:20:48.480
Because if there's one less, it's a tag team.
427
00:20:49.620 --> 00:20:50.740
But here you go.
428
00:20:50.780 --> 00:20:53.520
The new day should be on that list. Fuck. Yes.
429
00:20:53.660 --> 00:20:54.320
Yes, they should.
430
00:20:54.540 --> 00:20:56.240
They are one of the greatest factions of all time.
431
00:20:56.240 --> 00:20:58.280
I will I will give you that. Absolutely.
432
00:20:58.280 --> 00:21:00.020
Yeah. Very entertaining.
433
00:21:00.420 --> 00:21:01.780
Super over with the fans.
434
00:21:02.000 --> 00:21:05.580
A gimmick that shouldn't have gotten over and they did their own thing.
435
00:21:06.000 --> 00:21:10.920
Well, and a gimmick that Vince McMahon tried to turn into a gospel church
436
00:21:11.540 --> 00:21:13.560
immediately. It's like, dude.
437
00:21:14.040 --> 00:21:16.660
And they're just like, no, we're just going to do this pancake thing.
438
00:21:16.920 --> 00:21:18.980
Yeah. Yeah. Oh, my God.
439
00:21:19.480 --> 00:21:22.280
Pippen in the chat says Dark Order is in the running for my favorite.
440
00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:23.660
Very cool. Very cool.
441
00:21:23.660 --> 00:21:26.180
Dark Order has that
442
00:21:26.960 --> 00:21:30.220
that pandemic era thing where I will always love Dark Order
443
00:21:30.220 --> 00:21:33.960
for that time period when they they were kind of a weird faction.
444
00:21:33.960 --> 00:21:36.600
I liked the original Dark Order
445
00:21:36.600 --> 00:21:39.820
with all those weird guys in the masks that would just appear out of nowhere.
446
00:21:40.380 --> 00:21:41.500
You know what I mean? Yeah.
447
00:21:41.920 --> 00:21:44.900
Oh, I liked when they made the little throne of dudes
448
00:21:44.900 --> 00:21:46.840
that I would sit on. Yeah.
449
00:21:46.920 --> 00:21:49.720
But then, like over the pandemic era, they became.
450
00:21:49.900 --> 00:21:51.860
And of course, after the Brody Lee business,
451
00:21:52.380 --> 00:21:54.700
they kind of became the mascots of A.W.
452
00:21:54.820 --> 00:21:57.160
and they just, you know, it wasn't going to last forever.
453
00:21:57.180 --> 00:22:00.160
But like that whole thing with Hangman the first time around.
454
00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:02.740
And they were just this lovable bunch of weirdos.
455
00:22:02.880 --> 00:22:05.280
Yeah, I totally I like Dark Order.
456
00:22:05.460 --> 00:22:08.900
Well, and even so, it's like lovable bunch of weirdo losers, too.
457
00:22:08.900 --> 00:22:10.900
They don't win all that much.
458
00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:13.640
And they definitely don't win big matches all that much.
459
00:22:13.720 --> 00:22:16.540
What if we put seven mankind's on a team?
460
00:22:18.240 --> 00:22:19.980
Very true. Very true.
461
00:22:19.980 --> 00:22:25.700
But the other half are glad Armstrong and they have a massive fan base.
462
00:22:25.860 --> 00:22:27.260
I mean, people love the Dark Order.
463
00:22:27.420 --> 00:22:30.060
I see people say the Dark Order should be pushed more.
464
00:22:30.260 --> 00:22:31.480
And honestly, I don't agree.
465
00:22:31.700 --> 00:22:34.060
I just think they're great where they're at.
466
00:22:34.400 --> 00:22:35.020
I think they're great.
467
00:22:35.660 --> 00:22:37.540
Yeah, no, I don't think they need a big push.
468
00:22:37.920 --> 00:22:39.900
Blair Lank, clearly doing some research here, says
469
00:22:39.900 --> 00:22:43.020
shield members average seven world's titles each.
470
00:22:43.220 --> 00:22:46.280
And when the faction started with only Seth having been our champion,
471
00:22:46.280 --> 00:22:50.020
that faction has WWE World Universal Titles,
472
00:22:50.320 --> 00:22:54.900
ROH, IWGP and AEW World Titles, too hard to argue.
473
00:22:55.700 --> 00:22:58.080
Yeah, dude, statistics don't lie, man.
474
00:22:58.200 --> 00:23:00.700
Numerically, it's very hard to argue with that.
475
00:23:00.840 --> 00:23:04.120
I don't I don't think even the NWO can compete with that.
476
00:23:05.180 --> 00:23:08.360
No, Conan wasn't winning that many belts.
477
00:23:09.000 --> 00:23:14.400
Nuclear Westlzak showing that they are as big of a dork as we are.
478
00:23:14.400 --> 00:23:17.980
Where's the love for Devastation Incorporated for you noobs?
479
00:23:18.740 --> 00:23:21.560
Let's learn a little bit about Devastation Incorporated, shall we?
480
00:23:23.340 --> 00:23:25.920
Because they were in world class,
481
00:23:26.040 --> 00:23:31.520
and that's Scandor, Scandor, Scandor, Act bars, Stable.
482
00:23:32.640 --> 00:23:35.140
And I am going to pull them up here.
483
00:23:35.560 --> 00:23:37.680
Oh, yes. This is we're living in the future, folks.
484
00:23:37.700 --> 00:23:39.380
This is what kind of technology we have now.
485
00:23:39.380 --> 00:23:42.340
Well, this I've always wanted to do more of this kind of thing, because.
486
00:23:42.440 --> 00:23:44.080
Hold on. What if do it like this?
487
00:23:44.640 --> 00:23:47.740
Ready? No, but OK.
488
00:23:47.820 --> 00:23:50.380
Tell me, give me like a wink so I know you're ready, then I'll snap.
489
00:23:50.620 --> 00:23:51.520
Yeah. OK, cool.
490
00:23:52.780 --> 00:23:54.060
So you're going to do it.
491
00:23:55.160 --> 00:23:57.440
Scandor, Akbar, Scandor, Akbar.
492
00:23:57.500 --> 00:23:58.780
So Scandor, Akbar managed.
493
00:23:59.160 --> 00:24:01.640
I don't I don't know much about Devastation Incorporated, actually.
494
00:24:02.240 --> 00:24:04.340
So you were just going to try and take the wheel on this
495
00:24:04.340 --> 00:24:05.520
without even know what you're talking about.
496
00:24:05.580 --> 00:24:06.640
Oh, I wasn't. I'm not taking the wheel.
497
00:24:06.680 --> 00:24:08.260
That's why I was going to do like this little snap.
498
00:24:08.420 --> 00:24:09.480
And then see, look at that.
499
00:24:09.520 --> 00:24:11.300
You did it. And it appeared.
500
00:24:11.300 --> 00:24:14.100
I mean, don't tell me, you know, you're in the wheel.
501
00:24:14.300 --> 00:24:17.540
There isn't like cosmic something going on here.
502
00:24:18.140 --> 00:24:19.780
OK, something going on here.
503
00:24:19.800 --> 00:24:22.960
Yeah. What is Scandor Akbar's real name?
504
00:24:23.320 --> 00:24:26.260
It is Jimmy Saeed Weba.
505
00:24:26.920 --> 00:24:29.720
Oh, I thought it was just going to be like Jimmy Smith or something.
506
00:24:30.100 --> 00:24:31.440
Yeah. Well, I mean, it might as well have been.
507
00:24:31.520 --> 00:24:32.560
I mean, you heard the dude talk.
508
00:24:32.560 --> 00:24:36.600
He's just from a dude from Texas, from Wichita Falls, Texas.
509
00:24:36.860 --> 00:24:40.820
OK, so I was hoping there would be an actual entry
510
00:24:40.820 --> 00:24:42.440
for Devastation Incorporated.
511
00:24:42.580 --> 00:24:44.500
I was hoping that you would just be able to remember
512
00:24:44.500 --> 00:24:46.500
because I that's kind of what I rely on you.
513
00:24:46.700 --> 00:24:51.500
Jesus Christ. That's a lot of pressure and not very fair.
514
00:24:52.260 --> 00:24:53.440
Yeah. Well, anyway,
515
00:24:54.360 --> 00:24:57.120
you know, he basically managed all the top heels
516
00:24:57.120 --> 00:24:58.660
that came through fucking.
517
00:24:59.320 --> 00:25:01.600
Is it like is that that's like Bundy and stuff, right?
518
00:25:01.660 --> 00:25:03.780
Or no. Yeah, he managed Bundy.
519
00:25:03.840 --> 00:25:05.940
Yes. Yes. He managed King Kong Bundy.
520
00:25:05.940 --> 00:25:08.820
He managed Kamala. He managed the wheels here.
521
00:25:09.500 --> 00:25:10.460
Yeah, exactly.
522
00:25:10.460 --> 00:25:13.440
Yeah, this Wikipedia is just dogshit.
523
00:25:13.500 --> 00:25:14.360
OK, hold on.
524
00:25:14.920 --> 00:25:18.140
Just the same as there was great.
525
00:25:19.000 --> 00:25:21.560
That new day and the shield are factions.
526
00:25:21.880 --> 00:25:25.720
Another faction that people never talk about as a faction is the Freebirds.
527
00:25:25.740 --> 00:25:30.830
Now, we're the number one heels of multiple territories many times over.
528
00:25:31.400 --> 00:25:34.140
And actually had different incarnations
529
00:25:34.140 --> 00:25:37.620
because at one point, Buddy Rogers leaves, but he robers.
530
00:25:38.980 --> 00:25:42.480
And you have I mean, and Jimmy Garvin steps in then, right?
531
00:25:42.620 --> 00:25:46.300
Or does he step because at one point, there's a trio of Hayes,
532
00:25:48.000 --> 00:25:49.720
Garvin and Gordy.
533
00:25:50.000 --> 00:25:52.560
Yeah. But I always think of just the two versions,
534
00:25:52.580 --> 00:25:55.700
the original three man team and then the later on tag team,
535
00:25:55.780 --> 00:25:59.860
which sometimes had Fantasia or Bad Street in the group.
536
00:26:00.800 --> 00:26:02.260
Yeah, I think this has a few.
537
00:26:02.680 --> 00:26:05.580
Dusty Rhodes was not a member of Devastation Incorporated.
538
00:26:05.580 --> 00:26:07.380
You can't trust the Internet for anything.
539
00:26:07.560 --> 00:26:09.940
And yeah, but he did it at times.
540
00:26:09.940 --> 00:26:12.780
You know, it's just like the touring heels who need managers
541
00:26:12.780 --> 00:26:14.780
would come through and be managed by Scandor Akbar.
542
00:26:15.460 --> 00:26:18.940
So Abdullah, Kamala, King Kong, Bundy, Steve Austin,
543
00:26:19.760 --> 00:26:23.480
Cactus Jack, I know for sure was the Undertaker as the Punisher.
544
00:26:23.480 --> 00:26:24.160
Oh, wow.
545
00:26:24.660 --> 00:26:27.580
The missing link, a guy that doesn't get talked about enough.
546
00:26:27.800 --> 00:26:28.700
One man gang.
547
00:26:29.320 --> 00:26:31.960
Dr. Death, Steve Williams, which that surprises me.
548
00:26:32.020 --> 00:26:35.140
Ted DiBiase, an amazing group of people.
549
00:26:35.140 --> 00:26:37.860
Yeah, Greg the Humber Valentine, Dick Murdoch, Butch Reed,
550
00:26:38.020 --> 00:26:40.560
Nord the Barbarian, Al Perez, the Terminator,
551
00:26:41.020 --> 00:26:43.180
not specifically, not Arnold Schwarzenegger
552
00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:46.700
and Big Bubba Rogers Ray Traylor.
553
00:26:47.840 --> 00:26:50.540
Oli's role in The Horseman is to be a mean piece of shit,
554
00:26:50.820 --> 00:26:54.260
kind of like playing himself, but dialed down to about 60 percent.
555
00:26:54.560 --> 00:26:55.700
Yeah, I mean, that's kind of it.
556
00:26:55.800 --> 00:26:59.020
Oli to me never felt like a tough dude, but.
557
00:26:59.380 --> 00:27:01.640
Oh, no, Oli was a notorious tough dude.
558
00:27:01.640 --> 00:27:04.600
I know he is, but he was an old man by the time I saw him.
559
00:27:04.600 --> 00:27:05.960
Bleary lot.
560
00:27:06.200 --> 00:27:09.120
Freebirds, the only faction to be represented in Highlander.
561
00:27:09.220 --> 00:27:12.580
Thank you. The best fucking five minutes of professional wrestling
562
00:27:12.580 --> 00:27:15.980
that have ever been filmed in the history of time.
563
00:27:16.520 --> 00:27:18.800
That scene at the beginning of Highlander is so fucking cool.
564
00:27:19.380 --> 00:27:22.840
Were Mankind, Taker and Kane ever all managed by Paul Bearer
565
00:27:22.840 --> 00:27:24.480
at the same time? I don't think so.
566
00:27:25.400 --> 00:27:27.780
I don't think so. I know that Kane.
567
00:27:28.980 --> 00:27:32.840
Maybe not even Kane, but I know Vader and Mankind were
568
00:27:33.340 --> 00:27:35.740
managed by Paul Bearer at the same time.
569
00:27:35.740 --> 00:27:37.140
I don't think he was around at that point.
570
00:27:37.380 --> 00:27:39.240
I think I think that was pre-Kane.
571
00:27:39.340 --> 00:27:40.820
Yeah, the pre-Kane era.
572
00:27:42.560 --> 00:27:45.760
So getting back to the timeline that I got away from a little while ago.
573
00:27:45.860 --> 00:27:49.760
Yeah, the Four Horsemen were kind of the preeminent stable for a long time.
574
00:27:49.760 --> 00:27:51.480
That was kind of the standard and the template.
575
00:27:51.560 --> 00:27:56.920
And then in the early 90s, the greatest faction of all time,
576
00:27:57.120 --> 00:27:59.680
which was kind of like a stable because they did come together
577
00:27:59.680 --> 00:28:01.960
around a manager, was the Dangerous Alliance.
578
00:28:01.960 --> 00:28:05.800
Yes, which consisted of Ravishing Recruit, Medusa Masele,
579
00:28:06.560 --> 00:28:10.480
Stone Cold Stunning Steve Austin, Beautiful Bobby Eaton
580
00:28:11.120 --> 00:28:14.140
and Aaron Anderson, and then like Larry Zabisco or something.
581
00:28:14.260 --> 00:28:15.280
Larry Zabisco, baby.
582
00:28:15.840 --> 00:28:18.080
All of them. And Aaron and Larry were the tag team.
583
00:28:18.160 --> 00:28:19.360
They were called the enforcers.
584
00:28:19.500 --> 00:28:20.960
They were super cool.
585
00:28:23.080 --> 00:28:25.440
Bobby Eaton, I guess, probably was your pin eater.
586
00:28:26.040 --> 00:28:28.760
And then you had two anchors, which is really interesting
587
00:28:28.760 --> 00:28:31.140
because they didn't have the world champion.
588
00:28:31.140 --> 00:28:35.400
They had two guys, your television champ and your United States champ.
589
00:28:35.900 --> 00:28:39.640
And they had Medusa, which is kind of rare at that point
590
00:28:39.640 --> 00:28:41.700
to be like an ass kicker.
591
00:28:41.760 --> 00:28:44.460
That was a lady that I also didn't see that.
592
00:28:44.580 --> 00:28:47.000
She was also not really a wrestler.
593
00:28:47.180 --> 00:28:50.820
She was the director of covert operations,
594
00:28:51.400 --> 00:28:53.660
which I think is a ninja.
595
00:28:54.500 --> 00:28:57.240
Yeah, she's basically a ninja. Yeah. Yeah.
596
00:28:57.240 --> 00:28:58.440
But check this out.
597
00:29:00.080 --> 00:29:02.720
So bear with me one sec here.
598
00:29:03.020 --> 00:29:03.560
Stop screen.
599
00:29:03.820 --> 00:29:06.860
Last time I'm doing a screen share because that's slowing us down when I do it.
600
00:29:07.660 --> 00:29:09.820
Sorry. Fuck you, man.
601
00:29:10.780 --> 00:29:11.780
It's it's your fault.
602
00:29:12.160 --> 00:29:13.320
It's literally your fault.
603
00:29:15.300 --> 00:29:16.580
So what are you doing?
604
00:29:17.300 --> 00:29:18.260
What do you mean? What am I doing?
605
00:29:18.600 --> 00:29:19.820
I don't know. I thought you're saying something.
606
00:29:20.400 --> 00:29:21.380
I thought I was, too.
607
00:29:22.720 --> 00:29:23.400
There we go.
608
00:29:23.460 --> 00:29:25.220
Look at those motherfuckers.
609
00:29:25.220 --> 00:29:28.700
So look at the image that I had in my head, too.
610
00:29:28.720 --> 00:29:32.440
So is why is Bobby Eaton taking a shit in this picture?
611
00:29:32.520 --> 00:29:34.100
Well, that's a good question to agree.
612
00:29:34.440 --> 00:29:35.280
Other question.
613
00:29:35.660 --> 00:29:40.040
Well, other fact, Polly dangerously is like 24 in this picture.
614
00:29:40.280 --> 00:29:46.260
Like he looks like your great uncle, but he is 24.
615
00:29:46.640 --> 00:29:48.000
Like he is a very young man.
616
00:29:48.120 --> 00:29:50.080
Arne Anderson. Look at that group.
617
00:29:50.300 --> 00:29:53.360
So number one, Rick Rude should have been a world champion.
618
00:29:53.880 --> 00:29:54.860
Period. Period.
619
00:29:54.980 --> 00:29:55.820
Yeah, should have been.
620
00:29:55.960 --> 00:29:58.780
I mean, I think if not for his back injury, he probably would have been right.
621
00:29:58.940 --> 00:30:00.780
Yes. I mean, I think he was on his.
622
00:30:00.920 --> 00:30:03.980
Well, technically, he's the international champion or whatever.
623
00:30:04.880 --> 00:30:07.160
Yeah, but that was not a world title at that point.
624
00:30:07.160 --> 00:30:08.800
That was just a bullshit title.
625
00:30:09.600 --> 00:30:14.200
Then you got Larry and Arne as the enforcers. Right.
626
00:30:15.040 --> 00:30:18.540
And then Bobby and Arne do the tag team thing.
627
00:30:18.800 --> 00:30:22.320
And then you got Steve Austin, as you were.
628
00:30:22.320 --> 00:30:24.460
He's your up and coming stud.
629
00:30:24.540 --> 00:30:26.960
Like he's your guy that's on his way to the top. Exactly.
630
00:30:26.980 --> 00:30:29.760
He's your Luger ask profile guy.
631
00:30:30.140 --> 00:30:33.360
So like these guys did the modern template thing.
632
00:30:33.360 --> 00:30:34.840
But in my opinion.
633
00:30:35.960 --> 00:30:38.140
They could have been the greatest faction of all time.
634
00:30:38.360 --> 00:30:42.120
If they would have kept going, if Paul dangerously doesn't leave
635
00:30:42.120 --> 00:30:47.860
and file a anti amid charges of anti Semitism against Bill Watts
636
00:30:48.420 --> 00:30:50.940
and Rick Rude doesn't get permanently injured
637
00:30:50.940 --> 00:30:52.340
and it has to retire.
638
00:30:52.360 --> 00:30:54.380
You ever see that for horsemen shirt?
639
00:30:55.460 --> 00:31:00.800
No, the one that's like four horses and it totally looks like a swastika.
640
00:31:01.060 --> 00:31:02.040
Oh, my God. No.
641
00:31:02.040 --> 00:31:05.680
I wonder why you got all these charges of anti Semitism.
642
00:31:05.840 --> 00:31:08.180
Holy shit. I never saw that. Thank God.
643
00:31:08.380 --> 00:31:10.260
Yeah, it's I'll find a picture of it.
644
00:31:10.280 --> 00:31:13.320
It's pretty it's like really nobody looked at that shirt and said,
645
00:31:13.440 --> 00:31:16.220
hey, this looks like an obvious swastika anyway.
646
00:31:17.160 --> 00:31:19.760
Well, and so, Larry, don't worry.
647
00:31:19.760 --> 00:31:21.820
We're getting to the worst factions as well.
648
00:31:21.820 --> 00:31:23.500
We will be talking. There's so many.
649
00:31:23.820 --> 00:31:24.440
There's so many.
650
00:31:24.800 --> 00:31:26.080
And they're all in TNA.
651
00:31:26.420 --> 00:31:28.480
They're they're the history of TNA.
652
00:31:29.020 --> 00:31:31.740
But we haven't even gotten past the dangerous alliance yet.
653
00:31:31.960 --> 00:31:34.560
Yeah. So, yeah, I think the dangerous alliance.
654
00:31:35.040 --> 00:31:38.180
I mean, yeah, they're following the template, but they are doing that.
655
00:31:38.200 --> 00:31:40.600
I want to call them the Balding Alliance, but I won't do that.
656
00:31:40.720 --> 00:31:42.360
Look how many of them are balding, though.
657
00:31:42.400 --> 00:31:44.360
I mean, seriously. Hey, man, one balding.
658
00:31:45.200 --> 00:31:46.660
Yeah. Hey, man's balding.
659
00:31:46.980 --> 00:31:48.700
Arne is balding. Mm hmm.
660
00:31:49.760 --> 00:31:51.020
Austin is balding.
661
00:31:51.240 --> 00:31:52.620
Yeah, Austin was balding.
662
00:31:53.020 --> 00:31:55.760
Then Larry was just like he was.
663
00:31:55.920 --> 00:31:57.440
Larry was normal thinning.
664
00:31:57.480 --> 00:31:58.640
He was just thinning. Yeah.
665
00:31:58.640 --> 00:32:01.160
And then Bobby Eaton had a full head of hair.
666
00:32:01.460 --> 00:32:03.740
Yeah. Well, he's beautiful. Bobby is beautiful.
667
00:32:04.020 --> 00:32:07.340
I mean, you know, I mean, it's not a misleading name in any way.
668
00:32:08.000 --> 00:32:10.600
And then, yes, skewered universe with the most important question
669
00:32:10.600 --> 00:32:13.180
is Arne's acorn considered a separate, dangerous.
670
00:32:14.320 --> 00:32:16.120
Allegiance or allegiance.
671
00:32:16.860 --> 00:32:18.980
Yeah, that's close enough.
672
00:32:18.980 --> 00:32:20.460
He was talking fast. Yeah.
673
00:32:20.900 --> 00:32:21.880
I mean, yeah.
674
00:32:22.460 --> 00:32:23.060
Well, I like it.
675
00:32:23.060 --> 00:32:23.840
Dangerous allegiance.
676
00:32:24.120 --> 00:32:25.580
That's actually kind of like that better.
677
00:32:25.700 --> 00:32:29.040
That'll be the name of my faction that I start sweet.
678
00:32:29.360 --> 00:32:31.180
And our mission will be to destroy you.
679
00:32:32.280 --> 00:32:34.020
Yeah. Yeah.
680
00:32:34.260 --> 00:32:38.060
Well, great, because that makes me either Jerry Lawler or Hulk Hogan.
681
00:32:38.180 --> 00:32:39.260
Fuck you. Yeah.
682
00:32:39.260 --> 00:32:41.480
No, definitely more lawless with that mustache.
683
00:32:42.680 --> 00:32:45.000
Rick Rude was never a world champion. Shameful.
684
00:32:45.220 --> 00:32:46.680
Yes, it is. It is shameful.
685
00:32:46.680 --> 00:32:49.760
Really? Yes, very shameful.
686
00:32:50.040 --> 00:32:52.540
Did Haman ever have a full head of hair?
687
00:32:52.760 --> 00:32:59.400
No. If you see him in the late 80s in WCW slash NWA,
688
00:32:59.700 --> 00:33:02.540
he's got the Michael Keaton.
689
00:33:02.780 --> 00:33:05.000
I mean, his name was borrowed from the movie
690
00:33:05.000 --> 00:33:07.320
Johnny Dangerously that Michael Keaton in it
691
00:33:08.540 --> 00:33:10.620
because he had basically the same hairstyle.
692
00:33:12.300 --> 00:33:15.100
It's the cell phone use that caused him to go bald.
693
00:33:15.680 --> 00:33:19.800
Yeah. There was no regulations back then, you see.
694
00:33:20.000 --> 00:33:22.760
Exactly. And that's what ended up causing him to lose all of his hair.
695
00:33:22.900 --> 00:33:26.400
Yeah. Well, if he had been in WWF, he could have talked with
696
00:33:26.400 --> 00:33:29.620
Cy Sperling, who was the hair club for men.
697
00:33:29.700 --> 00:33:34.360
That was a faction unto itself of one of Cy Sperling.
698
00:33:35.540 --> 00:33:37.000
He was not just the owner.
699
00:33:37.120 --> 00:33:40.400
He's a client. And all right.
700
00:33:41.960 --> 00:33:43.760
So bullshit continues.
701
00:33:43.760 --> 00:33:46.440
Oh, also, I came across this quote, which I liked.
702
00:33:46.600 --> 00:33:49.160
All stables are factions, but not all factions are stables
703
00:33:49.160 --> 00:33:52.560
because some groups are about structure and others are about disruption.
704
00:33:53.120 --> 00:33:54.160
That is perfect.
705
00:33:54.680 --> 00:33:56.300
That's good. Like that.
706
00:33:56.340 --> 00:33:57.200
Yep. Yep. Yep.
707
00:33:57.460 --> 00:33:59.420
So what's after the dangerous alliance, really?
708
00:33:59.620 --> 00:34:02.240
Well, so after the dangerous alliance, there's kind of a gap.
709
00:34:02.520 --> 00:34:05.400
There isn't really are just aren't in flair.
710
00:34:05.400 --> 00:34:06.880
I remember at one point.
711
00:34:07.140 --> 00:34:10.880
Yeah. And Barry Barry kind of goes in his own direction.
712
00:34:10.880 --> 00:34:14.060
Then Flair leaves. Yeah.
713
00:34:14.960 --> 00:34:19.179
Flair leaves and aren't just kind of he's in the dangerous alliance.
714
00:34:20.719 --> 00:34:24.440
Because Flair are feuding with the Hollywood Blondes at some point.
715
00:34:25.120 --> 00:34:28.520
Yes. And that's when they are endowed
716
00:34:28.520 --> 00:34:31.860
with possibly the greatest horsemen of them all.
717
00:34:32.260 --> 00:34:34.440
And that would be pretty Paul Roma.
718
00:34:34.600 --> 00:34:36.699
Exactly. Yeah. Who else would there be?
719
00:34:37.719 --> 00:34:41.000
Yeah. That might be the moment where the horsemen jumped the shark.
720
00:34:41.659 --> 00:34:44.120
That's absolutely the moment where the horseman jumped the shark.
721
00:34:44.280 --> 00:34:45.659
There is no question.
722
00:34:46.880 --> 00:34:49.420
Mongo McMichael was a more credible member of that.
723
00:34:49.739 --> 00:34:51.620
Yeah. Then Paul Roma.
724
00:34:52.179 --> 00:34:55.000
Well, and it's weird because Paul Roma is totally one of those guys.
725
00:34:55.239 --> 00:34:58.140
I mean, I don't I couldn't tell you if Paul Roma was a good wrestler
726
00:34:58.140 --> 00:35:00.600
or not. I have no idea. I know he was solid.
727
00:35:00.660 --> 00:35:01.880
He was a good athlete, too.
728
00:35:02.640 --> 00:35:06.220
So he's a perfect example of one of those guys that, OK,
729
00:35:06.220 --> 00:35:09.160
he shouldn't have been a horseman because the horsemen are the elite.
730
00:35:09.540 --> 00:35:14.240
But. Stables are a good place for a guy who's a good hand.
731
00:35:14.480 --> 00:35:16.680
That's that's what they're for. They're for good hands.
732
00:35:17.160 --> 00:35:19.800
He is a perfect example of a dude that
733
00:35:20.500 --> 00:35:25.020
had his name tarnished on a nationwide level in a larger company
734
00:35:25.020 --> 00:35:29.200
and then went back to a smaller company and just never fucking recovered.
735
00:35:30.260 --> 00:35:32.800
Well, because that's a lot of WWE guys in the 80s.
736
00:35:32.840 --> 00:35:34.840
If you hear Paul tell some stories,
737
00:35:34.840 --> 00:35:36.940
one, you see why he never made it,
738
00:35:36.940 --> 00:35:40.460
because he sounds like he was really hard to work with and that he really liked
739
00:35:40.460 --> 00:35:45.300
that he wanted to kick everybody's ass for real. And.
740
00:35:45.640 --> 00:35:51.100
He tells a story about Jim Powers being hit on by
741
00:35:51.660 --> 00:35:56.340
Terry Garvin, somebody like that in the WWF and brushing him off
742
00:35:56.340 --> 00:35:59.880
and then going and complaining to the office about it.
743
00:36:00.280 --> 00:36:01.740
And Paul Roma goes, what are you doing?
744
00:36:01.780 --> 00:36:03.080
You just destroyed our push.
745
00:36:03.700 --> 00:36:07.740
And if you recall, I have heard that the young stallions
746
00:36:07.740 --> 00:36:10.300
were like this tag team on the rise in like 87.
747
00:36:11.040 --> 00:36:12.400
Right. They were young stallion.
748
00:36:12.480 --> 00:36:13.440
Yeah, the young stallions.
749
00:36:13.460 --> 00:36:17.560
And they finish the first ever big tag team elimination
750
00:36:17.560 --> 00:36:19.900
survivor series match. They're one of the sole survivors.
751
00:36:20.960 --> 00:36:23.640
And then they immediately become jobbers.
752
00:36:24.840 --> 00:36:28.480
Yeah. And Jim Powers was literally just a I mean,
753
00:36:29.060 --> 00:36:31.140
like I at least Roma had some like.
754
00:36:31.720 --> 00:36:34.120
Roma ends up with Hercules at some point,
755
00:36:34.160 --> 00:36:37.520
and powering glory ends up being a good tag team. Yeah.
756
00:36:38.720 --> 00:36:39.580
Well, he was a good athlete.
757
00:36:40.400 --> 00:36:43.020
I mean, I don't think he was not good enough for the horsemen.
758
00:36:43.120 --> 00:36:46.320
I think what it was, was they had been hinting that Tully Blanchard
759
00:36:46.320 --> 00:36:50.080
was coming for a long time and it was going to be
760
00:36:50.080 --> 00:36:53.920
I think it was going to be Flair, Tully, Arne and Windham again.
761
00:36:55.320 --> 00:36:58.820
And that totally at the last minute, they tried to lowball Tully
762
00:36:58.820 --> 00:36:59.900
and he said, fuck you.
763
00:36:59.900 --> 00:37:02.680
And then they scrambled and go, Paul Roma.
764
00:37:03.340 --> 00:37:05.220
So I think that was part of it.
765
00:37:05.500 --> 00:37:07.040
That's not the guy.
766
00:37:08.400 --> 00:37:10.820
Antoine says, how do you feel about since we say three members
767
00:37:10.820 --> 00:37:12.500
count the triple threat? Good.
768
00:37:12.800 --> 00:37:13.640
I like the triple threat.
769
00:37:14.180 --> 00:37:16.280
Yeah, I like the triple threat are fucking cool.
770
00:37:16.520 --> 00:37:18.440
Both incarnations of the triple threat.
771
00:37:18.500 --> 00:37:22.880
OK, because triple threat is Shane Douglas,
772
00:37:23.980 --> 00:37:26.200
Malinko and Benoit, right?
773
00:37:26.640 --> 00:37:31.600
First incarnation, second incarnation, Douglas Candido Bigelow.
774
00:37:33.100 --> 00:37:34.140
So, wow.
775
00:37:34.740 --> 00:37:39.200
So two thirds of the triple threat became one half of the horsemen.
776
00:37:39.460 --> 00:37:40.760
Right. Oh, yeah, good point.
777
00:37:41.100 --> 00:37:43.200
And Shane Douglas hates Rick Flair to like
778
00:37:44.120 --> 00:37:47.340
I'm right at that part in 94 where he just cannot shut
779
00:37:47.340 --> 00:37:49.920
the fuck up about Rick Flair, like about Rick Flair.
780
00:37:50.060 --> 00:37:52.040
Oh, my God, he's just burying him.
781
00:37:52.060 --> 00:37:53.780
I mean, even he doesn't even have a mic.
782
00:37:53.880 --> 00:37:55.420
He's saying something about Rick Flair.
783
00:37:55.420 --> 00:37:58.620
Oh, he's still he's actually managing a target right now,
784
00:37:58.620 --> 00:38:01.040
complaining about he's talking with Flair.
785
00:38:01.040 --> 00:38:02.800
Figures go in the son of a bitch.
786
00:38:03.100 --> 00:38:04.120
He's still working.
787
00:38:07.240 --> 00:38:08.920
Yeah. Wow, dude.
788
00:38:10.920 --> 00:38:13.000
Get stolen by Triple H.
789
00:38:13.000 --> 00:38:14.780
So anyway, that's great shit.
790
00:38:15.020 --> 00:38:15.760
That's great shit.
791
00:38:15.820 --> 00:38:17.880
And don't ever tell anybody I complimented degree.
792
00:38:19.180 --> 00:38:21.800
But yeah, so Roma joins.
793
00:38:21.920 --> 00:38:24.420
So basically, stables are really kind of dead as a friend.
794
00:38:24.420 --> 00:38:26.240
Stables exist.
795
00:38:26.640 --> 00:38:31.580
And then there is a faction that forms to eradicate hulk mania once again.
796
00:38:33.420 --> 00:38:35.020
It's Satan for children.
797
00:38:36.040 --> 00:38:37.680
It's the Dungeon of Doom.
798
00:38:38.760 --> 00:38:42.640
And all the various people that at one point were members
799
00:38:42.640 --> 00:38:44.900
of the Dungeon of Doom is pretty impressive, honestly,
800
00:38:45.360 --> 00:38:49.040
because did you know about a very impressive list 10 years prior?
801
00:38:49.400 --> 00:38:51.860
Yes. So Kamala.
802
00:38:52.700 --> 00:38:54.580
You also have
803
00:38:55.620 --> 00:38:57.140
Meng at one time.
804
00:38:57.860 --> 00:39:01.780
You have the giant big show.
805
00:39:02.160 --> 00:39:04.680
You also have a lot of people forget this.
806
00:39:04.680 --> 00:39:08.120
Vader, his last thing that he really does in WCW was
807
00:39:08.120 --> 00:39:09.980
he's a member of the Dungeon of Doom.
808
00:39:10.780 --> 00:39:13.000
Cactus Jack was a member of the Dungeon of Doom.
809
00:39:13.660 --> 00:39:15.620
What about wasn't John Tenta in the Dungeon of Doom?
810
00:39:15.680 --> 00:39:17.320
The shark, of course. Yes.
811
00:39:17.440 --> 00:39:19.600
And then was Zodiac in their zodiac.
812
00:39:19.600 --> 00:39:22.680
That was his that that was his whole gimmick was he was a member
813
00:39:22.680 --> 00:39:25.220
of the Dungeon of Doom after he had been the butcher
814
00:39:25.860 --> 00:39:28.740
and main evented the worst and lowest
815
00:39:28.740 --> 00:39:31.920
by rate stargate of all time against Hogan.
816
00:39:35.010 --> 00:39:37.630
But yeah, the Dungeon of Doom, one of the worst
817
00:39:38.690 --> 00:39:43.490
factions of all time, we are working on a Satan is for Children
818
00:39:43.490 --> 00:39:45.590
T-shirt right now.
819
00:39:45.590 --> 00:39:48.750
I was working on a design for it today degree.
820
00:39:48.750 --> 00:39:50.750
I will be sending it to you over the weekend.
821
00:39:50.750 --> 00:39:52.630
Or during throughout the week or something.
822
00:39:52.770 --> 00:39:54.390
You will have those for sale shortly.
823
00:39:55.110 --> 00:39:55.730
What's that?
824
00:39:56.150 --> 00:39:57.190
Have you contacted Kelvin?
825
00:39:57.490 --> 00:39:58.950
Kevin Sullivan's estate for this?
826
00:39:59.370 --> 00:40:00.430
Absolutely not.
827
00:40:01.970 --> 00:40:04.110
But let's see, let's see what the chat's saying here.
828
00:40:06.110 --> 00:40:08.870
I will say a tag team with a manager can't count either,
829
00:40:09.030 --> 00:40:10.570
despite there technically being three members,
830
00:40:10.750 --> 00:40:12.290
Midnight Express missing out totally.
831
00:40:12.910 --> 00:40:14.130
Yeah, yeah, that's the tag team.
832
00:40:14.410 --> 00:40:17.190
Yeah, I would say the Hollies were a faction
833
00:40:18.470 --> 00:40:20.090
because there was three of them.
834
00:40:20.090 --> 00:40:22.610
Yeah, I loved the Hollies.
835
00:40:22.610 --> 00:40:23.310
I did, too.
836
00:40:23.470 --> 00:40:25.950
But the best Holly was Crash by far.
837
00:40:26.650 --> 00:40:30.870
Bob Holly is so fucking lucky that he got paired with Crash.
838
00:40:31.570 --> 00:40:35.890
I liked Bob because he was doing that super heavyweight thing before Crash.
839
00:40:36.050 --> 00:40:37.050
And we liked him.
840
00:40:37.050 --> 00:40:38.450
Like, I thought he was cool back then.
841
00:40:38.490 --> 00:40:39.270
I thought he was funny.
842
00:40:39.370 --> 00:40:41.630
But yeah, when when they paired him with Crash,
843
00:40:41.690 --> 00:40:42.950
that took it to another level.
844
00:40:42.950 --> 00:40:45.690
And then Molly Holly getting thrown in there, too, was like,
845
00:40:46.410 --> 00:40:48.030
yeah, they're a faction now.
846
00:40:49.110 --> 00:40:51.490
Nuclear Wessels X very accurately says
847
00:40:51.490 --> 00:40:54.630
Dungeon of Doom needs its own episode, true, true.
848
00:40:57.130 --> 00:40:57.950
If only.
849
00:40:58.190 --> 00:41:00.590
So if so, I can go back and relive those things
850
00:41:00.590 --> 00:41:02.930
because I wasn't watching WCW at that point
851
00:41:03.590 --> 00:41:06.310
because Hulk Hogan was on and I don't like Hulk Hogan
852
00:41:06.310 --> 00:41:08.270
and they don't like to watch things with Hulk Hogan.
853
00:41:08.390 --> 00:41:10.150
So I was not watching that.
854
00:41:10.270 --> 00:41:13.570
Professor Degree's least favorite wrestler of all time.
855
00:41:15.550 --> 00:41:18.070
Terry Holder, Balaya Hogan.
856
00:41:18.770 --> 00:41:20.930
Yeah, yeah, he probably is.
857
00:41:21.350 --> 00:41:24.250
Well, I mean, we have a short out there where you say yes.
858
00:41:24.830 --> 00:41:26.990
No, but I mean, I've been thinking about it for two weeks
859
00:41:26.990 --> 00:41:29.910
ever since or three weeks or however long ago we recorded that.
860
00:41:29.950 --> 00:41:33.890
And I really can't think of any way that I dislike more than Hulk Hogan.
861
00:41:35.470 --> 00:41:37.390
Really don't care for him.
862
00:41:37.450 --> 00:41:38.390
Genuinely understandable.
863
00:41:38.950 --> 00:41:42.090
I like that one promo he cuts where he talks about Trump Tower
864
00:41:42.090 --> 00:41:45.230
falling apart and then you strap your arms
865
00:41:45.230 --> 00:41:47.110
on the biggest back in the world.
866
00:41:47.370 --> 00:41:48.690
I do like that.
867
00:41:48.690 --> 00:41:51.570
That's is that from 89 something like that.
868
00:41:51.570 --> 00:41:54.750
But it's just like, let me tell you something, Donald Trump.
869
00:41:54.910 --> 00:41:56.270
Like, that's pretty funny.
870
00:41:56.770 --> 00:41:58.130
But that was it.
871
00:41:58.270 --> 00:42:00.650
Yeti Malone with the take, I'm going to respect.
872
00:42:01.430 --> 00:42:02.410
DX is overrated.
873
00:42:02.770 --> 00:42:05.290
Dangerous Alliance is underrated. Yeah.
874
00:42:05.750 --> 00:42:08.850
Yeah. And we got some hot takes about best and worst
875
00:42:08.850 --> 00:42:10.090
that we'll get to at the end.
876
00:42:10.090 --> 00:42:12.650
Everybody, you save your save your hatreds for the end
877
00:42:12.650 --> 00:42:15.370
because he got a lot of time to spend on it.
878
00:42:15.610 --> 00:42:18.930
OK, I know it's more modern.
879
00:42:18.970 --> 00:42:21.850
Not everyone's cup of tea, but the Wyatt family NXT cult version,
880
00:42:21.890 --> 00:42:24.630
not the family friendly main roster version. Listen.
881
00:42:25.610 --> 00:42:29.530
I loved the Wyatts because I saw the potential of the Wyatts.
882
00:42:29.530 --> 00:42:33.410
But in order for it to work, Bray Wyatt needed to be full of shit.
883
00:42:33.830 --> 00:42:37.650
Right. Like he needed to be what I wanted him to be was like.
884
00:42:38.770 --> 00:42:43.230
A liar and a manipulator and a deceiver of the highest order.
885
00:42:43.590 --> 00:42:45.810
That's how I thought he could be utilized best.
886
00:42:45.910 --> 00:42:49.050
And instead, they ended up turning him into this fucking,
887
00:42:49.650 --> 00:42:53.170
you know, cosmic, right, undertaker guy.
888
00:42:53.310 --> 00:42:56.270
And it was like, guys, no, what are you doing?
889
00:42:57.350 --> 00:42:59.750
And he could have presented himself that way,
890
00:42:59.930 --> 00:43:03.170
but been a liar and a charlatan underneath it all.
891
00:43:03.490 --> 00:43:03.910
And they could have.
892
00:43:03.950 --> 00:43:06.910
Yeah, the original like Cape Fear kind of thing that they had.
893
00:43:06.910 --> 00:43:08.650
Wayland Mercy thing.
894
00:43:08.650 --> 00:43:12.310
Yes, with the with the torch and all that, that was cool.
895
00:43:12.370 --> 00:43:13.670
And like, it was cool shit.
896
00:43:14.210 --> 00:43:16.890
Yeah, I never really saw it like
897
00:43:16.890 --> 00:43:18.870
like you're saying, just didn't get the potential.
898
00:43:19.070 --> 00:43:22.030
I think you could take all those guys because they all just got cut.
899
00:43:22.030 --> 00:43:24.170
Right. I think you could take them.
900
00:43:24.250 --> 00:43:25.870
Make I mean, I don't know who's in the group,
901
00:43:25.870 --> 00:43:27.950
so I really don't know what their talent level is.
902
00:43:27.950 --> 00:43:30.650
But this is my this is how my what I'm thinking.
903
00:43:31.070 --> 00:43:36.050
You could reinvent them as that exactly what you're describing.
904
00:43:36.050 --> 00:43:38.150
We've never been supernatural.
905
00:43:38.370 --> 00:43:39.370
We've never been monsters.
906
00:43:39.370 --> 00:43:41.030
We're just messing with your head.
907
00:43:41.690 --> 00:43:44.770
And you could maybe like TNA could use something like that.
908
00:43:44.830 --> 00:43:45.290
You know what I mean?
909
00:43:45.550 --> 00:43:47.710
Major League Wrestling could use something like that.
910
00:43:47.910 --> 00:43:49.790
Yeah, I think that's kind of where the right
911
00:43:49.790 --> 00:43:52.070
destination level that you're thinking of here.
912
00:43:52.090 --> 00:43:52.770
Yeah, I know.
913
00:43:53.770 --> 00:43:57.510
Yeah. Or they could team up with fucking Rosemary and Ali.
914
00:43:57.570 --> 00:43:59.690
By the way, did you see that Ali is in TNA again?
915
00:44:00.510 --> 00:44:01.550
No, I did not know that.
916
00:44:01.590 --> 00:44:02.490
Yeah. So the bunny.
917
00:44:03.250 --> 00:44:05.410
Yeah, I get up with Rosemary.
918
00:44:05.410 --> 00:44:09.810
Yeah. Have them always has a home for weird kind of supernatural,
919
00:44:10.030 --> 00:44:11.210
spooky kind of people.
920
00:44:11.950 --> 00:44:13.270
Yeah. Yeah.
921
00:44:13.510 --> 00:44:15.650
So we get to 96.
922
00:44:16.150 --> 00:44:18.530
The faction thing isn't really happening anymore.
923
00:44:18.530 --> 00:44:22.930
It's more like, you know, some there's some stables.
924
00:44:23.290 --> 00:44:26.030
Jimmy Hart's managing the remnants of the Dungeon of Doom.
925
00:44:26.270 --> 00:44:31.410
Yeah. And what's going on in WWF at that point, even in 96?
926
00:44:32.550 --> 00:44:33.910
Cornett may be managing.
927
00:44:33.910 --> 00:44:35.270
Yeah, you got Camp Cornett.
928
00:44:35.650 --> 00:44:39.010
So you've got Camp Cornett and that's, you know, Davey Boy,
929
00:44:39.190 --> 00:44:40.850
Yokozuna and Owen Hart.
930
00:44:41.310 --> 00:44:45.410
Right. And that's maybe the only faction at the time, I think.
931
00:44:46.930 --> 00:44:49.630
Yeah. I mean, that's pretty much it.
932
00:44:49.850 --> 00:44:51.070
Yeah. Yeah.
933
00:44:53.490 --> 00:44:56.110
Then something very small happened
934
00:44:56.710 --> 00:44:59.810
in World Championship Wrestling that no one has ever really talked
935
00:44:59.810 --> 00:45:00.830
about very much.
936
00:45:00.830 --> 00:45:04.230
Nobody's ever imitated one hundred and fifty thousand times.
937
00:45:04.950 --> 00:45:07.990
And it definitely didn't change the modern wrestling industry forever.
938
00:45:08.750 --> 00:45:10.430
No, not at all.
939
00:45:11.010 --> 00:45:12.830
So there's the New World Order.
940
00:45:13.070 --> 00:45:14.470
Yeah, there's the NWI.
941
00:45:14.470 --> 00:45:15.290
I've heard of them.
942
00:45:15.430 --> 00:45:17.030
I had never seen any of their stuff.
943
00:45:17.350 --> 00:45:19.750
No. Yeah. For this episode, I did a little research.
944
00:45:19.910 --> 00:45:21.390
Apparently, Hogan was in it.
945
00:45:21.810 --> 00:45:23.070
That's what I hear. Yeah.
946
00:45:23.710 --> 00:45:25.730
So Scott Hall shows up.
947
00:45:26.110 --> 00:45:27.210
Kevin Nash shows up.
948
00:45:28.110 --> 00:45:29.530
And then Hogan's the third man.
949
00:45:29.530 --> 00:45:32.810
And the implication is that it's WWF invasion.
950
00:45:34.610 --> 00:45:36.250
How long after that, the six join?
951
00:45:37.630 --> 00:45:42.050
I think six is towards the end of the year, like the end of 96.
952
00:45:42.070 --> 00:45:43.590
He's the fourth man.
953
00:45:44.310 --> 00:45:45.370
No, he's not.
954
00:45:45.630 --> 00:45:48.670
I think the giant joins before he was six.
955
00:45:49.190 --> 00:45:52.190
I wasn't watching the time because I don't like Hulk Hogan.
956
00:45:52.670 --> 00:45:53.370
But go on.
957
00:45:54.410 --> 00:45:57.190
I think six joins before Bischoff.
958
00:45:57.190 --> 00:46:00.950
So technically, the way the technically the way it works
959
00:46:00.950 --> 00:46:04.910
is it's so it would be Hall, Nash, Hogan,
960
00:46:07.470 --> 00:46:11.910
DBSI, then I think the giant, then six, then Bischoff.
961
00:46:12.310 --> 00:46:13.090
Really? Yeah.
962
00:46:13.090 --> 00:46:18.570
I always thought this six was like one plus two plus three equals six.
963
00:46:18.770 --> 00:46:20.810
But maybe somebody just said that to me,
964
00:46:20.810 --> 00:46:22.470
and that wasn't actually from a promo.
965
00:46:22.470 --> 00:46:24.410
I could be wrong. I could be off on the timeline.
966
00:46:24.650 --> 00:46:25.590
Wouldn't it be a great promo?
967
00:46:25.710 --> 00:46:26.970
They could have cut anyway.
968
00:46:26.970 --> 00:46:32.890
WWF invades WCW and everything fucking changes.
969
00:46:32.970 --> 00:46:35.410
And it's no longer WCW.
970
00:46:35.650 --> 00:46:37.870
It's WCW versus NWO.
971
00:46:38.910 --> 00:46:42.870
And so then you have DBSI, you have the giant, you have
972
00:46:44.130 --> 00:46:46.230
Michael Wall Street or whatever.
973
00:46:46.230 --> 00:46:47.930
Fuck, man, he was so great.
974
00:46:48.670 --> 00:46:51.110
And then and then it just.
975
00:46:51.990 --> 00:46:55.370
Buff Bagwell, Scott Norton, Conan.
976
00:46:56.970 --> 00:47:01.390
And then it splits into two NWOs, maybe something like that.
977
00:47:01.810 --> 00:47:04.230
It's just fucking just my God.
978
00:47:04.430 --> 00:47:05.890
You got Muda, Chono.
979
00:47:06.090 --> 00:47:07.990
Then you have the NWO Japan.
980
00:47:08.270 --> 00:47:12.830
Then you have Bischoff become so enamored of the NWO.
981
00:47:12.870 --> 00:47:15.850
He wants to replace WCW with the NWO
982
00:47:16.490 --> 00:47:19.070
as a as a brand head of security, Vincent.
983
00:47:19.190 --> 00:47:20.590
Thank you. Nuclear.
984
00:47:21.130 --> 00:47:22.310
Nuclear Wessel's. Oh, yeah.
985
00:47:22.930 --> 00:47:26.490
Basically, if you had ever been in WWF,
986
00:47:26.490 --> 00:47:27.990
then you ended up in the NWO.
987
00:47:28.090 --> 00:47:30.050
Big Bubba Rogers was in the NWO.
988
00:47:31.930 --> 00:47:33.390
Big Bubba, no trouble.
989
00:47:33.690 --> 00:47:35.110
Big Bubba, no trouble, baby.
990
00:47:36.010 --> 00:47:37.550
Bagwell, son of a bitch.
991
00:47:37.770 --> 00:47:41.210
Horace, dude, that was a good run for Buff.
992
00:47:41.910 --> 00:47:43.990
Buff in the New World Order is my favorite buff.
993
00:47:44.590 --> 00:47:48.150
Yeah, that's I I did not like him at the time.
994
00:47:48.210 --> 00:47:49.710
But in retrospect, yeah.
995
00:47:49.810 --> 00:47:51.190
Oh, man, I love him.
996
00:47:51.270 --> 00:47:55.910
And when he would go like, I'm Buff and I'm the stuff like that was
997
00:47:55.910 --> 00:47:58.330
it was so douche baggy.
998
00:47:58.530 --> 00:47:59.650
It was just perfect for him.
999
00:47:59.730 --> 00:48:02.510
It felt like you were seeing the real guy, you know?
1000
00:48:02.690 --> 00:48:04.810
Yep. Yeah, it was just funny.
1001
00:48:05.170 --> 00:48:06.870
Like it or not, that's who he was.
1002
00:48:08.210 --> 00:48:11.290
And NWO should have been more than six members at a time.
1003
00:48:11.790 --> 00:48:17.730
I mean, yes, I agree that there were a lot of like hiccups.
1004
00:48:18.590 --> 00:48:21.650
Because the guys had limited dates on their contracts,
1005
00:48:22.470 --> 00:48:25.850
they just would go periods of time where they weren't on TV or whatever.
1006
00:48:25.850 --> 00:48:29.150
And it would kind of mess things up, I think.
1007
00:48:30.810 --> 00:48:33.010
But, you know, for that first year,
1008
00:48:33.130 --> 00:48:37.630
I would say from their founding in 96 all the way up to 97,
1009
00:48:37.850 --> 00:48:40.270
even if there were bad times in between.
1010
00:48:41.510 --> 00:48:46.890
That whole initial run where they get up to Starcade 97 with Sting.
1011
00:48:48.630 --> 00:48:51.730
Excellent storytelling, especially for the time.
1012
00:48:52.130 --> 00:48:53.930
Oh, yeah, for its time.
1013
00:48:54.730 --> 00:48:59.590
If not for Sting and the fuck up at Starcade 97,
1014
00:48:59.890 --> 00:49:02.590
that it would go down like in history.
1015
00:49:02.690 --> 00:49:04.450
I mean, it's gone down in history anyway.
1016
00:49:04.690 --> 00:49:07.250
It went down in history for the wrong reason.
1017
00:49:07.450 --> 00:49:09.270
Yeah, I mean, it's yeah.
1018
00:49:09.590 --> 00:49:09.830
Yeah.
1019
00:49:09.830 --> 00:49:14.010
And then when they split up, I would put, you know,
1020
00:49:14.010 --> 00:49:16.750
I know people are fond of this shit, but dude,
1021
00:49:16.870 --> 00:49:19.130
NWO Wolfpack fucking dog shit.
1022
00:49:19.130 --> 00:49:19.950
It was terrible.
1023
00:49:20.250 --> 00:49:21.790
It was horrible.
1024
00:49:23.690 --> 00:49:25.750
It's absolutely fucking terrible.
1025
00:49:26.450 --> 00:49:30.770
It's like the thing that the NWO is weird because.
1026
00:49:30.810 --> 00:49:33.150
Factions and stables are traditionally bad guys.
1027
00:49:33.630 --> 00:49:35.730
And, you know, they're technically bad guys,
1028
00:49:35.750 --> 00:49:38.650
but they're getting cheered because they're cooler than the good guys.
1029
00:49:39.330 --> 00:49:42.690
So it's this weird thing where it's like, you know,
1030
00:49:42.690 --> 00:49:45.950
normally a guy, Randy Savage is a popular heel.
1031
00:49:46.250 --> 00:49:48.810
Well, we got to turn him face because he's popular heel, you know,
1032
00:49:49.030 --> 00:49:51.310
anybody, whatever, go down the list,
1033
00:49:51.310 --> 00:49:53.690
punk, you know, swerve was bad guy.
1034
00:49:53.770 --> 00:49:54.490
They turned him good.
1035
00:49:54.650 --> 00:49:56.970
I mean, just cool bad guys.
1036
00:49:56.970 --> 00:49:58.690
You have to turn face at some point.
1037
00:49:58.790 --> 00:50:01.850
And the NWO is like this weird opposite where it's like,
1038
00:50:01.990 --> 00:50:05.290
hey, let's put Sting and Luger in the NWO.
1039
00:50:05.530 --> 00:50:07.170
That was the jump the shark.
1040
00:50:07.170 --> 00:50:09.170
There's no going back moment for me.
1041
00:50:09.290 --> 00:50:11.090
It was doesn't even make any sense.
1042
00:50:11.250 --> 00:50:14.890
So they branch off into two factions within the faction.
1043
00:50:14.910 --> 00:50:15.270
Right.
1044
00:50:15.370 --> 00:50:20.670
So it's NWO Hollywood, you know, Hennig and Hogan and Hall
1045
00:50:20.670 --> 00:50:26.390
are the big eight, three, eight, the three big H's of the NWR in one group.
1046
00:50:26.730 --> 00:50:30.730
But yeah, when Sting joined, I was like, OK, this is fucking stupid.
1047
00:50:30.850 --> 00:50:31.650
All right. Right.
1048
00:50:32.310 --> 00:50:33.810
Like, this is fucking stupid.
1049
00:50:33.930 --> 00:50:36.750
Sting's whole fucking thing was destroying the NWO.
1050
00:50:36.830 --> 00:50:41.430
So Sting is basically admitting that he fucking failed on every level
1051
00:50:41.430 --> 00:50:42.930
and he just joins them instead.
1052
00:50:43.290 --> 00:50:47.090
But the phone paints a space like a tomato and looks absolutely stupid.
1053
00:50:47.190 --> 00:50:47.650
So stupid.
1054
00:50:47.750 --> 00:50:49.570
And then he had the little beard thing going for a while.
1055
00:50:49.570 --> 00:50:50.630
I was like, what's going on?
1056
00:50:51.830 --> 00:50:52.690
What's going on?
1057
00:50:52.830 --> 00:50:53.730
He still has that little.
1058
00:50:53.770 --> 00:50:54.650
I know he does.
1059
00:50:55.090 --> 00:50:57.250
Hey, old man Sting is the best.
1060
00:50:57.490 --> 00:50:57.750
Oh, dude.
1061
00:50:58.210 --> 00:50:59.490
Wizard Sting is the best.
1062
00:50:59.610 --> 00:50:59.950
Yes.
1063
00:51:00.570 --> 00:51:01.370
He's unbelievably.
1064
00:51:01.570 --> 00:51:04.630
One of the greatest things the wrestling industry has ever created, honestly.
1065
00:51:05.230 --> 00:51:06.210
Is old man Sting?
1066
00:51:06.490 --> 00:51:06.550
Yeah.
1067
00:51:06.550 --> 00:51:08.570
Yeah, dude, I fucking love old man Sting.
1068
00:51:09.490 --> 00:51:12.770
Nuclear Whistler's Axe points out that Six was called Six
1069
00:51:12.770 --> 00:51:13.970
because he was the Six member.
1070
00:51:15.030 --> 00:51:16.450
Yeah, that's what I was thinking in my head.
1071
00:51:16.510 --> 00:51:18.450
One, two, like, oh, he's the Six member.
1072
00:51:18.730 --> 00:51:19.590
Oh, hey.
1073
00:51:19.670 --> 00:51:20.010
There you go.
1074
00:51:20.010 --> 00:51:21.450
That's not what I was thinking in my head.
1075
00:51:21.450 --> 00:51:22.390
That's not what you were thinking.
1076
00:51:22.650 --> 00:51:24.730
Remember the other day before we started recording, you were like, I'm going to.
1077
00:51:24.890 --> 00:51:27.890
I did a bunch of research so that I could make myself look smarter than you
1078
00:51:27.890 --> 00:51:28.770
and make you look stupid.
1079
00:51:28.770 --> 00:51:28.990
Yeah.
1080
00:51:28.990 --> 00:51:29.790
When you said that.
1081
00:51:29.790 --> 00:51:29.910
Yeah.
1082
00:51:30.010 --> 00:51:31.790
You didn't even have to do all that fucking research, dude.
1083
00:51:32.350 --> 00:51:32.570
Yeah.
1084
00:51:34.250 --> 00:51:36.730
So Antoine says that he's on the opposite side.
1085
00:51:36.750 --> 00:51:37.450
The Wolf Pack.
1086
00:51:37.570 --> 00:51:38.970
Why don't you put that quote up there?
1087
00:51:39.530 --> 00:51:41.150
Oh, because it contradicts what I was saying.
1088
00:51:41.710 --> 00:51:42.070
Exactly.
1089
00:51:42.250 --> 00:51:42.550
The end.
1090
00:51:42.550 --> 00:51:45.190
The Wolf Pack saved the NWO from being totally redundant.
1091
00:51:45.330 --> 00:51:46.110
I was fine with them.
1092
00:51:46.350 --> 00:51:49.310
Antoine, I have a great deal of respect for you, but you are wrong.
1093
00:51:49.310 --> 00:51:50.070
I'm sorry.
1094
00:51:51.830 --> 00:51:58.110
Now, the one thing I will give you is that the Wolf Pack theme song at the time,
1095
00:51:58.470 --> 00:52:00.790
because I just listened to it last week on my way home from work,
1096
00:52:01.050 --> 00:52:03.590
it does not hold up as well as I hoped it would.
1097
00:52:04.050 --> 00:52:06.330
But man, I thought it was really cool.
1098
00:52:07.970 --> 00:52:10.250
Wolf Pack caused mass destruction.
1099
00:52:10.630 --> 00:52:12.530
Don't you know the bad boys of wrestling?
1100
00:52:12.850 --> 00:52:15.930
And I swear to God for years, I thought the next line was,
1101
00:52:16.090 --> 00:52:16.870
bet your bottom dollar.
1102
00:52:17.010 --> 00:52:18.470
And then I don't know where they went from there.
1103
00:52:18.470 --> 00:52:19.350
I was like, really?
1104
00:52:19.430 --> 00:52:19.990
Is that they said?
1105
00:52:20.970 --> 00:52:21.950
No, I'm sorry, Antoine.
1106
00:52:21.990 --> 00:52:23.210
I have to disagree.
1107
00:52:23.690 --> 00:52:25.430
It just didn't work.
1108
00:52:25.450 --> 00:52:26.330
Not for me.
1109
00:52:26.450 --> 00:52:26.730
It didn't work.
1110
00:52:26.970 --> 00:52:29.830
And didn't Savage jump from one to the other?
1111
00:52:29.930 --> 00:52:33.670
Didn't Savage jump from Hollywood to the Wolf Pack?
1112
00:52:33.930 --> 00:52:35.010
And red and black does.
1113
00:52:35.070 --> 00:52:37.550
I mean, like, obviously the colors look really cool together.
1114
00:52:39.230 --> 00:52:42.430
So then the NWO goes on for a really long time.
1115
00:52:43.150 --> 00:52:44.590
It just keeps coming back.
1116
00:52:44.710 --> 00:52:46.110
They can never let it go.
1117
00:52:46.290 --> 00:52:48.410
They do the silver thing for a while.
1118
00:52:49.190 --> 00:52:52.770
One thing I will say that I always thought was really cool about DX
1119
00:52:53.250 --> 00:52:58.430
was I liked the idea that they were just an offshoot,
1120
00:52:58.850 --> 00:53:00.310
like literally because it's the click.
1121
00:53:00.450 --> 00:53:00.890
You know what I mean?
1122
00:53:00.930 --> 00:53:04.870
So like, it's just the NWO taking over two companies.
1123
00:53:04.870 --> 00:53:07.210
And you couldn't really obviously say that,
1124
00:53:07.210 --> 00:53:08.670
but you could kind of wink wink.
1125
00:53:09.990 --> 00:53:13.210
That was kind of cool to me, like when I was in my 20s or whatever it was.
1126
00:53:13.290 --> 00:53:14.630
That was a neat idea.
1127
00:53:15.230 --> 00:53:17.790
DX just turned into a bunch of stupid kids.
1128
00:53:18.510 --> 00:53:19.870
Frat boy kind of shit.
1129
00:53:19.870 --> 00:53:21.990
Well, they didn't say that they were always that.
1130
00:53:21.990 --> 00:53:29.490
But I think DX aged like shit and it was not as good as the NWO at any point ever.
1131
00:53:29.910 --> 00:53:31.110
It's all just crap.
1132
00:53:31.270 --> 00:53:33.230
And it's frat boy shit.
1133
00:53:33.250 --> 00:53:39.390
And it's a pale imitation in a lot of ways because aside from the tank thing.
1134
00:53:39.450 --> 00:53:41.110
OK, they really the tank thing.
1135
00:53:41.170 --> 00:53:42.330
That was a slam dunk.
1136
00:53:42.410 --> 00:53:44.630
They really nailed that at the time.
1137
00:53:44.690 --> 00:53:47.270
They made WCW look like shit like.
1138
00:53:49.150 --> 00:53:49.630
But.
1139
00:53:49.950 --> 00:53:54.950
Nash and Hall and Hogan, what they did was so much bigger than anything DX ever did.
1140
00:53:55.730 --> 00:53:56.010
Absolutely.
1141
00:53:57.290 --> 00:53:59.110
Well, Nash and Hall are actually.
1142
00:54:00.590 --> 00:54:03.650
Larry Lyons says DX has managed to age poorly twice.
1143
00:54:04.470 --> 00:54:07.910
And Nash and Hall were actually legitimately like pretty cool.
1144
00:54:08.150 --> 00:54:09.010
Like, you know what I mean?
1145
00:54:09.250 --> 00:54:11.470
Yes, Sean and Hunter were not cool dudes.
1146
00:54:11.690 --> 00:54:15.890
They were like they were trying to desperately convince you that they were cool.
1147
00:54:16.530 --> 00:54:18.450
Which is kind of what this podcast is.
1148
00:54:18.930 --> 00:54:22.650
But yeah, not even not even close to the end of you.
1149
00:54:22.830 --> 00:54:23.150
God damn it.
1150
00:54:23.250 --> 00:54:23.930
I keep clicking this.
1151
00:54:23.990 --> 00:54:24.690
It was not a tank.
1152
00:54:24.710 --> 00:54:25.730
It was a jeep.
1153
00:54:25.730 --> 00:54:27.170
I mean, yes, it was a tank.
1154
00:54:27.430 --> 00:54:29.910
It was kind of dressed up like it was a tank.
1155
00:54:31.390 --> 00:54:32.910
DX had the most banger theme ever, though.
1156
00:54:32.910 --> 00:54:34.170
It was good for us.
1157
00:54:34.250 --> 00:54:34.870
Oh, yeah.
1158
00:54:35.190 --> 00:54:36.050
Yeah, it was.
1159
00:54:36.310 --> 00:54:37.330
And I liked it.
1160
00:54:37.330 --> 00:54:41.510
Reed made it as a goals theme music years later.
1161
00:54:41.510 --> 00:54:41.830
Yeah.
1162
00:54:44.590 --> 00:54:48.710
Well, and then Hunter, when he goes solo, he has like kind of an offshoot
1163
00:54:48.710 --> 00:54:50.270
of the DX music at first.
1164
00:54:51.050 --> 00:54:52.090
That's way better.
1165
00:54:52.670 --> 00:54:54.250
My time, my time.
1166
00:54:54.410 --> 00:54:54.810
Yeah.
1167
00:54:55.090 --> 00:54:55.270
Yeah.
1168
00:54:55.530 --> 00:54:56.430
So bad.
1169
00:54:56.690 --> 00:54:57.530
It's not good.
1170
00:54:58.010 --> 00:55:02.050
It's just better than the Motorhead shit that he was coming out to later.
1171
00:55:02.050 --> 00:55:02.990
You don't like the Motorhead song?
1172
00:55:05.170 --> 00:55:07.290
You don't like time to play the game.
1173
00:55:07.570 --> 00:55:12.010
I I don't know if you guys saw my post on Blue Sky or threads earlier,
1174
00:55:12.010 --> 00:55:16.770
but I said, hey, Chad, GBT, can you make me a Motorhead cover band
1175
00:55:16.770 --> 00:55:19.770
whose lead singer who plays at the pub on Thursdays?
1176
00:55:19.810 --> 00:55:22.290
If their lead singer doesn't have to work late as a wrestler
1177
00:55:22.870 --> 00:55:27.910
with some mildly unhinged symbology.
1178
00:55:27.910 --> 00:55:29.150
And it was just Triple H.
1179
00:55:29.290 --> 00:55:33.010
Yeah, kind of nervous about his gear.
1180
00:55:33.010 --> 00:55:33.290
Yeah.
1181
00:55:33.350 --> 00:55:33.990
Fuck Triple H.
1182
00:55:34.070 --> 00:55:35.910
I got no I despise that.
1183
00:55:36.030 --> 00:55:36.670
I got no point.
1184
00:55:36.770 --> 00:55:37.370
No purpose to relate.
1185
00:55:37.670 --> 00:55:37.830
Yeah.
1186
00:55:37.870 --> 00:55:41.310
I mean, we have glazed over the ministry, the corporate ministry,
1187
00:55:41.310 --> 00:55:45.550
the corporation, the union, which, of course, was mankind.
1188
00:55:47.530 --> 00:55:50.250
Ken Shamrock test test.
1189
00:55:50.250 --> 00:55:50.690
Yeah.
1190
00:55:50.750 --> 00:55:51.190
Right.
1191
00:55:51.690 --> 00:55:52.790
And they all came out with two.
1192
00:55:52.890 --> 00:55:53.450
And there's somebody.
1193
00:55:53.990 --> 00:55:55.130
Ahmed Johnson, maybe?
1194
00:55:55.290 --> 00:55:59.690
No, it wasn't Ahmed, the other faction from WWF.
1195
00:55:59.770 --> 00:56:00.550
That should be mentioned.
1196
00:56:01.590 --> 00:56:03.430
That should be mentioned as a great one.
1197
00:56:03.550 --> 00:56:04.450
It was the nation.
1198
00:56:04.910 --> 00:56:10.750
And I think the nation did not go as far as they should have.
1199
00:56:11.810 --> 00:56:14.830
Farouk had a lot of juice as a leader of the nation.
1200
00:56:15.610 --> 00:56:18.090
And I get that they wanted to elevate the rock.
1201
00:56:18.670 --> 00:56:22.630
And I get that ultimately Farouk's job was to get the rock over
1202
00:56:22.630 --> 00:56:24.170
and to help him get there.
1203
00:56:24.190 --> 00:56:26.490
And that worked really fucking well.
1204
00:56:27.050 --> 00:56:30.670
But Farouk should have had a world title run.
1205
00:56:31.490 --> 00:56:31.870
I think so.
1206
00:56:32.130 --> 00:56:38.930
I think pre-Attitude Era Farouk, 96, that guy could have held the belt.
1207
00:56:38.930 --> 00:56:43.150
I mean, the title reigns were like fucking five minutes long back then.
1208
00:56:43.190 --> 00:56:45.270
You know, he could have held the belt for a month.
1209
00:56:45.550 --> 00:56:45.910
Yeah.
1210
00:56:45.910 --> 00:56:47.350
I mean, at that point, who's holding the belt?
1211
00:56:47.350 --> 00:56:52.150
Shawn Michaels, Shawn Michaels, Sid Undertaker.
1212
00:56:52.970 --> 00:56:57.670
You could have easily slotted Farouk in there and leveled him up a little bit.
1213
00:56:57.810 --> 00:56:59.850
And yeah, he already had the team built in.
1214
00:57:01.530 --> 00:57:04.390
I will say, though, that shit with the rock, like, well done.
1215
00:57:04.630 --> 00:57:07.030
Yes, that worked really well.
1216
00:57:07.030 --> 00:57:07.910
Yeah.
1217
00:57:08.070 --> 00:57:11.230
So we get these, you know, faction warfare becomes kind of a thing.
1218
00:57:11.230 --> 00:57:14.950
You end up with, you know, the DXNWO Wolfpack.
1219
00:57:16.410 --> 00:57:16.870
You have.
1220
00:57:17.630 --> 00:57:18.430
Go ahead.
1221
00:57:19.130 --> 00:57:23.210
WWE's answer to the I think, at least to the to the NWO was
1222
00:57:23.210 --> 00:57:26.470
all of their, as you said, the gang warfare shit.
1223
00:57:26.650 --> 00:57:27.710
You had Los Boricuas.
1224
00:57:27.850 --> 00:57:30.150
You had the Nazi biker guys.
1225
00:57:31.050 --> 00:57:34.190
You are on my list of the worst race war.
1226
00:57:34.190 --> 00:57:34.530
Yeah.
1227
00:57:34.530 --> 00:57:41.090
You know, basically Vince's answer to the the faction warfare was a race war.
1228
00:57:41.330 --> 00:57:44.030
That's basically what he was perpetuating.
1229
00:57:44.110 --> 00:57:49.010
It was the nation versus the Los Boricuas versus the Nazi biker guys.
1230
00:57:49.030 --> 00:57:49.250
Yeah.
1231
00:57:49.290 --> 00:57:52.550
The skinhead who were literally Nazi skinhead.
1232
00:57:52.570 --> 00:57:52.810
Yeah.
1233
00:57:52.890 --> 00:57:55.130
To the Bruce, the Harris brothers were skinheads.
1234
00:57:55.690 --> 00:57:58.310
And that stuff is just I don't know if.
1235
00:57:59.410 --> 00:58:02.030
I don't know what the purpose was, if he thought he was going to like
1236
00:58:02.590 --> 00:58:06.450
the idea of the NWO or what he thought he was doing, but it's not.
1237
00:58:06.530 --> 00:58:07.470
None of it was good.
1238
00:58:07.530 --> 00:58:10.550
I mean, it's just kind of that's garbagey stuff.
1239
00:58:11.450 --> 00:58:13.410
Yeah, I just think that.
1240
00:58:15.530 --> 00:58:18.490
There was, I mean, so Antoine says.
1241
00:58:19.590 --> 00:58:23.090
The nation could not have worked if Farouk did not lead it the way he did and ran it.
1242
00:58:23.090 --> 00:58:24.330
It was absolutely a race war.
1243
00:58:24.550 --> 00:58:24.950
Yeah.
1244
00:58:25.650 --> 00:58:29.010
Also, the nation of domination is always going to have a place as one of my favorites.
1245
00:58:29.090 --> 00:58:31.530
They represented to me as a black man's strength and power.
1246
00:58:31.530 --> 00:58:32.530
Farouk was the loser.
1247
00:58:32.890 --> 00:58:41.530
He should have, then he would have been the only black wrestler to hold the WCW and WWEF titles.
1248
00:58:42.010 --> 00:58:47.570
I think honestly, Ron Simmons as Farouk showed me something that I had never seen in him before
1249
00:58:47.570 --> 00:58:53.530
as Farouk when he was giving these really great promos.
1250
00:58:53.750 --> 00:58:55.790
I mean, they stand the test of time.
1251
00:58:55.830 --> 00:58:59.310
If you go back and watch them now, they are really, really good promos.
1252
00:58:59.370 --> 00:59:00.290
He's passionate.
1253
00:59:00.490 --> 00:59:00.790
Yes.
1254
00:59:00.790 --> 00:59:02.810
He didn't have that as the WCW champ.
1255
00:59:03.050 --> 00:59:04.410
You know, he was cool, but.
1256
00:59:04.890 --> 00:59:08.310
I loved Ron Simmons and everything, but he just kind of won the world title out of nowhere.
1257
00:59:08.550 --> 00:59:09.830
You know, it was with no build.
1258
00:59:10.010 --> 00:59:13.050
That's why he didn't really last very long as a world champion.
1259
00:59:13.270 --> 00:59:15.890
And then he loses and disappears for a couple of years.
1260
00:59:16.050 --> 00:59:17.530
You know, he's an ECW.
1261
00:59:17.930 --> 00:59:19.170
He's bouncing around the Indies.
1262
00:59:19.170 --> 00:59:19.870
He's in Japan.
1263
00:59:20.170 --> 00:59:22.750
Working at a Coca-Cola factory, I think.
1264
00:59:22.830 --> 00:59:24.450
Yeah, it's weird.
1265
00:59:25.130 --> 00:59:26.850
We just went back to the civilian world.
1266
00:59:27.670 --> 00:59:28.070
Yeah.
1267
00:59:28.850 --> 00:59:29.530
Always never.
1268
00:59:29.710 --> 00:59:32.910
I wasn't watching wrestling during NWO, but the Wolfpack Red and Black was legit.
1269
00:59:32.910 --> 00:59:34.970
And I liked them because they were opposing Hogan, LOL.
1270
00:59:36.890 --> 00:59:37.410
So, yes.
1271
00:59:37.590 --> 00:59:39.230
So, OK, so we all.
1272
00:59:39.450 --> 00:59:40.070
Well, you know what?
1273
00:59:40.170 --> 00:59:43.970
Listen, I'm 49 and I didn't like the Star Wars prequels when they came out,
1274
00:59:43.970 --> 00:59:47.650
but I've recently I've come to learn that a lot of people grew up with them because
1275
00:59:47.650 --> 00:59:50.110
we just come at things from different perspectives.
1276
00:59:50.310 --> 00:59:50.990
Listen to me.
1277
00:59:51.990 --> 00:59:54.590
Green screen technology was brand new at the time.
1278
00:59:55.470 --> 00:59:59.930
And George Lucas was not reined in by anybody at that time.
1279
01:00:00.110 --> 01:00:05.010
His wife played a very key role in editing the originals, OK?
1280
01:00:05.010 --> 01:00:05.270
She did.
1281
01:00:05.450 --> 01:00:08.510
And they were divorced when he made the prequels, right?
1282
01:00:08.590 --> 01:00:10.910
And you can tell you could really, really tell.
1283
01:00:12.090 --> 01:00:13.610
They were bad.
1284
01:00:13.850 --> 01:00:17.210
They're not good movies, but I know people grew up with them.
1285
01:00:17.250 --> 01:00:20.410
I want to be respectful and people like bad movies.
1286
01:00:20.410 --> 01:00:21.030
That's fine.
1287
01:00:21.370 --> 01:00:21.730
That's fine.
1288
01:00:21.810 --> 01:00:24.570
Yeah, you don't know shit and you like bad movies.
1289
01:00:24.570 --> 01:00:25.230
That's fine.
1290
01:00:28.010 --> 01:00:31.330
Come out of the don't ever challenge us on this Wolfpack thing, all right?
1291
01:00:31.490 --> 01:00:32.150
Yeah, I know.
1292
01:00:32.230 --> 01:00:33.110
Jesus Christ.
1293
01:00:34.730 --> 01:00:36.710
Yeah, George Lucas could not direct people.
1294
01:00:36.810 --> 01:00:39.510
If you can make Natalie Portman look like she doesn't know how to act,
1295
01:00:39.790 --> 01:00:43.250
then you pretty successfully failed as a director.
1296
01:00:43.350 --> 01:00:46.370
Take the best actor in the world and make her look like complete garbage.
1297
01:00:46.590 --> 01:00:48.730
Yeah, we're going to make her look completely incompetent.
1298
01:00:49.970 --> 01:00:50.390
Yes.
1299
01:00:50.890 --> 01:00:52.210
So, you know, then.
1300
01:00:52.290 --> 01:00:56.730
So, yeah, you get like tons of factions come out of this pippin in the chat.
1301
01:00:57.630 --> 01:01:01.130
Well, you have you mean street posse.
1302
01:01:01.130 --> 01:01:01.870
Holy shit.
1303
01:01:02.450 --> 01:01:02.790
I forgot.
1304
01:01:03.130 --> 01:01:05.270
Actually, that's a guilty pleasure.
1305
01:01:05.370 --> 01:01:05.850
I love me.
1306
01:01:05.890 --> 01:01:06.470
Street posse.
1307
01:01:06.570 --> 01:01:07.510
Yeah, I do like to meet you.
1308
01:01:07.870 --> 01:01:11.270
And then obviously, the Heart Foundation is amazing.
1309
01:01:12.050 --> 01:01:14.830
And the mean street posse are a good example of just like
1310
01:01:14.830 --> 01:01:18.270
sometimes you just need bad guys to fucking lose.
1311
01:01:18.270 --> 01:01:20.610
They need to get humiliated.
1312
01:01:20.890 --> 01:01:21.950
They're so irritating.
1313
01:01:22.170 --> 01:01:25.430
You can't wait to watch them just get their asses beat.
1314
01:01:25.430 --> 01:01:27.590
And that's totally what the mean street posse was.
1315
01:01:28.110 --> 01:01:30.470
And like I was in my early 20s at the time.
1316
01:01:30.930 --> 01:01:32.290
I hated people like that.
1317
01:01:32.390 --> 01:01:33.570
I knew people like that.
1318
01:01:33.610 --> 01:01:34.010
Fuck one.
1319
01:01:34.210 --> 01:01:35.230
Not from Greenwich, obviously.
1320
01:01:35.350 --> 01:01:39.310
But I'm just, yeah, you know, you don't like those kind of people.
1321
01:01:40.050 --> 01:01:42.050
Wanted to want to get their asses beat.
1322
01:01:42.290 --> 01:01:42.770
Yeah.
1323
01:01:42.770 --> 01:01:45.430
And then you have, you know, 3MB.
1324
01:01:46.670 --> 01:01:47.990
Oh, sorry.
1325
01:01:48.090 --> 01:01:48.970
I was thinking of three.
1326
01:01:49.050 --> 01:01:50.250
Was it three count that?
1327
01:01:50.370 --> 01:01:52.070
That's what I was thinking of initially, too.
1328
01:01:52.070 --> 01:01:53.870
It was three count with Evan Courageous and shit.
1329
01:01:54.010 --> 01:01:55.450
And Shane Helms and Shannon Moore.
1330
01:01:56.150 --> 01:01:58.410
They were a boy band group.
1331
01:01:59.310 --> 01:02:01.810
Also, I consider the mean posse.
1332
01:02:01.810 --> 01:02:02.090
Yeah.
1333
01:02:02.090 --> 01:02:06.890
Pat Patterson and the bris and brisco like honorary members of the mean street posse.
1334
01:02:06.970 --> 01:02:10.290
Just because they were getting their ass kicked every week and it was hilarious.
1335
01:02:12.250 --> 01:02:12.630
But yeah.
1336
01:02:12.630 --> 01:02:14.870
And then, you know, TNA comes along
1337
01:02:14.870 --> 01:02:19.250
and really recycles pretty much as much as they're trying to say
1338
01:02:19.250 --> 01:02:20.950
they're different than WWE.
1339
01:02:21.010 --> 01:02:23.410
They're basically booked exactly the same.
1340
01:02:23.770 --> 01:02:25.330
It's shock television.
1341
01:02:27.390 --> 01:02:31.270
And, you know, I can't go super hard on all of these, but, you know, Immortal.
1342
01:02:33.170 --> 01:02:33.850
Main, main.
1343
01:02:34.870 --> 01:02:38.830
Immortal, I think, was Flair's group, wasn't it?
1344
01:02:39.030 --> 01:02:39.910
It's AJ Styles.
1345
01:02:40.130 --> 01:02:41.250
AJ Styles with Flair.
1346
01:02:41.390 --> 01:02:41.770
Okay.
1347
01:02:41.990 --> 01:02:44.730
And that's where AJ's like young Flair.
1348
01:02:45.290 --> 01:02:46.210
Some shit.
1349
01:02:47.030 --> 01:02:48.470
But you have the main event, Mafia.
1350
01:02:49.590 --> 01:02:54.530
You eventually get to Aces and Eights, which is an all time shit show of a stable.
1351
01:02:56.030 --> 01:02:59.770
It just feels like TNA just took the NWO thing
1352
01:02:59.770 --> 01:03:02.990
and just recycled it over and over and over.
1353
01:03:03.150 --> 01:03:05.150
I don't recall there ever being a time.
1354
01:03:05.290 --> 01:03:06.250
I know this isn't true.
1355
01:03:06.990 --> 01:03:10.830
I don't recall a period in TNA where there isn't someone trying to take over.
1356
01:03:11.030 --> 01:03:12.270
A huge faction of people.
1357
01:03:12.530 --> 01:03:14.850
Can we talk about the best version of this?
1358
01:03:16.110 --> 01:03:18.370
The band, huh?
1359
01:03:18.690 --> 01:03:20.130
The band, huh?
1360
01:03:20.350 --> 01:03:23.090
We're going to take one line from the Blues Brothers,
1361
01:03:23.390 --> 01:03:27.070
which is 35 years old, and we're going to run it into the ground.
1362
01:03:27.110 --> 01:03:27.690
Yeah.
1363
01:03:28.050 --> 01:03:28.390
Yeah.
1364
01:03:28.390 --> 01:03:33.370
And at that time, Kevin Nash has been called Coach Nash or something for some reason.
1365
01:03:34.390 --> 01:03:37.030
So I have a memory in my mind of Scott Hall
1366
01:03:37.030 --> 01:03:41.710
wearing like an Elvis honky tonk man kind of suit that happened, right?
1367
01:03:41.850 --> 01:03:42.790
I don't know.
1368
01:03:43.450 --> 01:03:45.170
Like, I don't know.
1369
01:03:45.190 --> 01:03:46.390
It's just yeah.
1370
01:03:46.530 --> 01:03:50.050
And at that, I mean, you want to talk about phoning it in, you know?
1371
01:03:50.470 --> 01:03:50.650
Yes.
1372
01:03:51.150 --> 01:03:51.670
Yes.
1373
01:03:53.090 --> 01:03:54.130
Just not.
1374
01:03:55.090 --> 01:03:58.390
Blair E-Line brings up a great one that I forgot about the BWO,
1375
01:03:58.550 --> 01:03:59.510
the Blue World Order.
1376
01:03:59.650 --> 01:04:00.490
That was fun.
1377
01:04:01.070 --> 01:04:04.830
Great because you have like a satire of what's going on.
1378
01:04:04.970 --> 01:04:05.370
Currently.
1379
01:04:05.630 --> 01:04:06.150
Yeah.
1380
01:04:06.150 --> 01:04:09.110
I mean, that was a really good concept and those guys are funny.
1381
01:04:09.370 --> 01:04:11.950
And they were they were literally coming out
1382
01:04:13.290 --> 01:04:19.450
and cosplaying as the NWO, but they were also lip syncing to kiss.
1383
01:04:20.730 --> 01:04:23.630
It's like Scare Glow.
1384
01:04:24.170 --> 01:04:26.170
There are political lessons to learn from the prequels
1385
01:04:26.170 --> 01:04:29.530
that I wish were better paid paid better attention to, especially now.
1386
01:04:29.590 --> 01:04:32.370
You know, Scare Glow, I agree with you, but here's the thing.
1387
01:04:32.550 --> 01:04:35.470
George Lucas made those all of that.
1388
01:04:35.550 --> 01:04:37.970
So mind numbing to follow that.
1389
01:04:37.990 --> 01:04:39.270
I think a lot of people missed that part.
1390
01:04:39.450 --> 01:04:40.430
It's the unfortunate thing.
1391
01:04:40.430 --> 01:04:46.430
The prequels are amazing on paper and they would have had to be like a six
1392
01:04:46.430 --> 01:04:48.470
movie thing to really work.
1393
01:04:48.850 --> 01:04:52.070
The thing I do love about this is going to have to be a different podcast.
1394
01:04:52.270 --> 01:04:56.150
I have learned to love the prequels because I do have an appreciation
1395
01:04:56.150 --> 01:04:58.270
for like 1930s movie serials.
1396
01:04:58.270 --> 01:05:00.710
How do I get rid of degree books and shit like that?
1397
01:05:00.730 --> 01:05:03.910
But that's probably why I'm getting AARP letters in the mail.
1398
01:05:03.910 --> 01:05:05.070
Anyway, yeah.
1399
01:05:07.150 --> 01:05:09.610
There is a best version of teenage factions.
1400
01:05:09.790 --> 01:05:10.410
Millionaire's Club.
1401
01:05:10.530 --> 01:05:11.850
That was the absolute worst.
1402
01:05:12.170 --> 01:05:13.890
I cannot believe they all got together for that group.
1403
01:05:13.930 --> 01:05:15.370
The only blemish on Sting's career.
1404
01:05:15.630 --> 01:05:17.470
Is that same thing as the Main Event Mafia?
1405
01:05:18.030 --> 01:05:19.570
That's the Main Event Mafia.
1406
01:05:20.010 --> 01:05:21.510
Millionaire's Club was WCW.
1407
01:05:21.810 --> 01:05:26.210
So Millionaire's Club was when they did the New Blood versus
1408
01:05:26.810 --> 01:05:30.690
the Millionaire's Club and they gambled that everybody would boo
1409
01:05:31.390 --> 01:05:34.610
the established stars and cheer the young guys.
1410
01:05:34.990 --> 01:05:38.710
And instead they booed the New Blood and cheered the Millionaire's Club.
1411
01:05:39.770 --> 01:05:43.150
And then your baby faces are guys called the Millionaire's Club.
1412
01:05:45.130 --> 01:05:46.910
Good underdogs fighting for money.
1413
01:05:48.210 --> 01:05:52.110
Yeah, the lessons to be learned from WCW are being
1414
01:05:53.370 --> 01:05:55.790
seen in the current WWE product.
1415
01:05:56.090 --> 01:05:56.250
But yes.
1416
01:05:56.630 --> 01:05:57.010
Oh, yeah.
1417
01:05:58.490 --> 01:06:01.170
So then, you know, New Japan.
1418
01:06:02.190 --> 01:06:02.710
Yeah.
1419
01:06:02.770 --> 01:06:04.250
Enters the picture.
1420
01:06:04.310 --> 01:06:09.290
And New Japan, you know, the 2000s Anokism period of New Japan is pretty bad.
1421
01:06:10.170 --> 01:06:12.990
And they have something to be optimistic about.
1422
01:06:13.130 --> 01:06:15.990
It's kind of like New Japan right now, where it's like,
1423
01:06:16.590 --> 01:06:21.390
I will say quality wise, New Japan is much better right now than New Japan at that time.
1424
01:06:21.950 --> 01:06:26.210
But you have something to be hopeful about because you have the young talent like
1425
01:06:26.210 --> 01:06:33.330
Nakamura and Hiroshi Tanahashi, who definitely have something going right.
1426
01:06:34.090 --> 01:06:34.610
But.
1427
01:06:35.690 --> 01:06:40.570
Nakamura really throws New Japan on its ass when he creates he turns heel and creates chaos.
1428
01:06:40.990 --> 01:06:42.610
That is his group that he creates.
1429
01:06:42.990 --> 01:06:47.330
And pretty soon all of New Japan, you're in a faction if you're in New Japan.
1430
01:06:47.950 --> 01:06:52.170
And that is very counter to any American.
1431
01:06:52.550 --> 01:06:54.270
That's when all the faction stuff started.
1432
01:06:54.270 --> 01:06:56.210
This is all this is all new for me.
1433
01:06:56.510 --> 01:06:57.270
So yeah, yeah.
1434
01:06:57.270 --> 01:06:59.670
So it's like around 2010 ish.
1435
01:07:00.390 --> 01:07:03.950
Toru Yanu turns on Tobi Mach toke.
1436
01:07:03.950 --> 01:07:04.630
Yeah, Machabe.
1437
01:07:06.230 --> 01:07:10.270
And they start running roughshod over over New Japan.
1438
01:07:10.330 --> 01:07:14.310
But the other thing to understand is that they have a working relationship with CMLL
1439
01:07:14.310 --> 01:07:19.490
and it's not uncommon for New Japan wrestlers to go spend a lot of time in Mexico.
1440
01:07:20.970 --> 01:07:23.810
And the Stardust genius Tetsuya Naito,
1441
01:07:23.810 --> 01:07:28.290
the man of Antoine Antoine's man.
1442
01:07:28.970 --> 01:07:35.970
OK, his goat goes and spends time in CMLL because he was basically the Roman reigns
1443
01:07:35.970 --> 01:07:39.370
of New Japan where he just wasn't getting over organically.
1444
01:07:39.470 --> 01:07:42.730
And the crowd was turning on him kind of like they're doing with Shota Umino
1445
01:07:42.730 --> 01:07:46.030
where they're just booing him and they want something else from him.
1446
01:07:46.290 --> 01:07:49.330
And he goes over and spends some time in CMLL.
1447
01:07:49.510 --> 01:07:52.970
Nakamura also came back from CMLL and became rock star Nakamura.
1448
01:07:52.970 --> 01:07:58.650
But he becomes he brings what he discovers over there.
1449
01:07:58.790 --> 01:07:59.750
Los Ingobernables.
1450
01:07:59.830 --> 01:08:06.270
He brings a Japan version over and they become a massive draw for New Japan as well.
1451
01:08:06.330 --> 01:08:09.690
It seemed for a time like New Japan just could do nothing wrong.
1452
01:08:10.450 --> 01:08:20.630
I mean, Gato's run from like 2011 ish to like 2020 should be studied for a century to come.
1453
01:08:20.630 --> 01:08:22.270
Like it's almost perfect.
1454
01:08:23.010 --> 01:08:25.330
It's big enough that I was.
1455
01:08:26.450 --> 01:08:32.790
Kind of on the outs of wrestling and New Japan was the thing that really
1456
01:08:33.410 --> 01:08:36.330
got me kind of interested again, the shit that was going on there.
1457
01:08:36.330 --> 01:08:39.370
I didn't know anything about it, and I still don't know anything about it.
1458
01:08:39.370 --> 01:08:41.750
But there was so much buzz surrounding it.
1459
01:08:41.750 --> 01:08:45.950
You couldn't not notice, you know, you couldn't couldn't help but pay attention.
1460
01:08:46.250 --> 01:08:49.250
You have other factions like Suzuki Goon.
1461
01:08:49.390 --> 01:08:51.470
It was it was it was a wild time.
1462
01:08:51.470 --> 01:08:56.950
And so basically everybody except like Kota Ibushi and Hiroshi Tanahashi
1463
01:08:56.950 --> 01:09:00.130
and a few others is in a faction by that point, right?
1464
01:09:00.630 --> 01:09:01.870
Bullet Club is gigantic.
1465
01:09:02.210 --> 01:09:06.330
You know, it's because it's it starts off almost as a parody of the NWO
1466
01:09:06.330 --> 01:09:07.710
and then it becomes the NWO.
1467
01:09:08.630 --> 01:09:11.130
Pippen asks, is there a faction that has more subgroups than Bullet Club?
1468
01:09:11.330 --> 01:09:12.569
No, there is not.
1469
01:09:13.270 --> 01:09:15.270
Well, nobody has lasted as long.
1470
01:09:15.470 --> 01:09:17.710
How long did Bullet Club actually last?
1471
01:09:17.710 --> 01:09:22.029
It started in 2010 and it lasted until 2025.
1472
01:09:23.290 --> 01:09:24.090
Wow. Yeah.
1473
01:09:24.330 --> 01:09:27.569
And like for the most part was always pretty hot.
1474
01:09:27.850 --> 01:09:28.729
Right. Right.
1475
01:09:29.010 --> 01:09:32.069
I mean, I feel like in recent years, it's not the same.
1476
01:09:32.470 --> 01:09:36.510
But, well, the war dogs were not the true successors of Bullet Club.
1477
01:09:36.649 --> 01:09:39.090
I think Bullet Club died when Jay White left, really.
1478
01:09:39.729 --> 01:09:41.630
Blair Alliance evidence fair.
1479
01:09:41.830 --> 01:09:44.750
We also got to remember it was Kojima Goon first.
1480
01:09:45.210 --> 01:09:49.109
It was and then it was taken over by Minoru Suzuki.
1481
01:09:50.010 --> 01:09:53.350
It really is a wild thing to kind of have
1482
01:09:53.850 --> 01:09:57.430
factions controlling the entire promotion and they're all angling for power
1483
01:09:57.430 --> 01:10:00.670
and, you know, who controls the titles and stuff like that.
1484
01:10:01.010 --> 01:10:07.770
And then AEW comes along and they create an American version of the same thing.
1485
01:10:08.410 --> 01:10:09.130
Yeah.
1486
01:10:09.490 --> 01:10:14.090
Where in early AEW, particularly, everybody's in a faction.
1487
01:10:14.090 --> 01:10:17.410
Like it was a tough thing.
1488
01:10:17.590 --> 01:10:21.170
I've got friends who were on like out of wrestling
1489
01:10:21.170 --> 01:10:25.490
and they came back with the more recent boom, especially AEW.
1490
01:10:25.770 --> 01:10:27.890
And it was very odd to them.
1491
01:10:28.250 --> 01:10:30.930
And I mean, admittedly, when I first started watching it,
1492
01:10:30.930 --> 01:10:33.730
it was odd seeing everybody's on a team.
1493
01:10:34.090 --> 01:10:37.670
And I knew a little bit about New Japan, so it was easier for me to roll with it.
1494
01:10:37.830 --> 01:10:40.010
But I know a lot of people kind of came in and they're just like,
1495
01:10:40.370 --> 01:10:43.510
what like what's up with everyone being in a faction?
1496
01:10:43.510 --> 01:10:45.710
And it's kind of just commonplace to me now.
1497
01:10:45.730 --> 01:10:47.330
I don't think anything about it.
1498
01:10:48.290 --> 01:10:52.030
I think it's just the next stage of where the kind of evolution of wrestling,
1499
01:10:52.030 --> 01:10:54.510
I guess, like this is where you are.
1500
01:10:54.630 --> 01:10:57.070
It makes sense to have factions.
1501
01:10:57.270 --> 01:10:58.430
It makes sense to have teams.
1502
01:10:58.470 --> 01:11:01.950
And have backup and have people who have your back, you know.
1503
01:11:02.210 --> 01:11:03.170
It's nothing else.
1504
01:11:03.990 --> 01:11:08.710
Look, man, Bandido gets into some shit with Andrade and Brody's his buddy.
1505
01:11:08.850 --> 01:11:10.390
So Brody comes and backs him up.
1506
01:11:10.510 --> 01:11:12.350
While Andrade is a member of the Don Callis family.
1507
01:11:12.350 --> 01:11:14.450
Well, now you've got a whole feud going on.
1508
01:11:14.450 --> 01:11:17.330
If you have two factions warring with each other,
1509
01:11:17.690 --> 01:11:20.610
that's a million different matches that can all take place.
1510
01:11:20.690 --> 01:11:23.610
If you're the top guy in a faction, you can say,
1511
01:11:24.050 --> 01:11:26.610
you got to get through all six of these guys to get to me.
1512
01:11:27.710 --> 01:11:30.550
It just kind of makes sense from like it's almost like a
1513
01:11:31.350 --> 01:11:34.430
plug and play, easy storytelling kind of.
1514
01:11:34.470 --> 01:11:35.070
Well, you know what I mean?
1515
01:11:35.110 --> 01:11:37.130
You would have factions with a ton of people in them.
1516
01:11:37.170 --> 01:11:42.050
So like you had the nightmare family had a bazillion people in it.
1517
01:11:42.050 --> 01:11:47.010
What the fuck was QT Marshall's group called when they turned on Cody?
1518
01:11:47.990 --> 01:11:51.430
I just remember like there were like two or three women
1519
01:11:51.430 --> 01:11:54.170
that had to shave their head to join the nightmare family.
1520
01:11:54.370 --> 01:11:55.930
And then it didn't go anywhere.
1521
01:11:56.250 --> 01:11:56.710
No, no, no.
1522
01:11:56.750 --> 01:11:57.990
That was Brandy's group.
1523
01:11:58.150 --> 01:12:01.030
That was the nightmare family.
1524
01:12:01.590 --> 01:12:03.110
It wasn't the nightmare family.
1525
01:12:03.150 --> 01:12:04.390
That was Cody's group.
1526
01:12:04.570 --> 01:12:07.550
So that's where Cody had all his trainees and stuff.
1527
01:12:08.170 --> 01:12:09.210
And Arne was a part of it.
1528
01:12:09.210 --> 01:12:10.930
The factory was QT Marshall.
1529
01:12:10.930 --> 01:12:12.630
The factory, right?
1530
01:12:12.650 --> 01:12:13.590
Because he ran the school.
1531
01:12:13.810 --> 01:12:14.910
The nightmare factory, right.
1532
01:12:15.690 --> 01:12:19.250
And then it was the nightmare collective was Brandy's.
1533
01:12:20.590 --> 01:12:22.510
And they did it for like three or four weeks.
1534
01:12:22.950 --> 01:12:24.690
That lady joins, A.W.
1535
01:12:24.850 --> 01:12:25.910
Shaves her fucking head.
1536
01:12:26.590 --> 01:12:29.270
And then they had an awesome Kong too.
1537
01:12:29.310 --> 01:12:30.330
An awesome Kong is great.
1538
01:12:30.350 --> 01:12:33.410
Well, an awesome Kong had to leave, you know, retire basically.
1539
01:12:33.810 --> 01:12:37.170
And then Brandy decides she doesn't want to do it anymore.
1540
01:12:37.170 --> 01:12:39.630
And in a BTE skit, she talks to a therapist
1541
01:12:39.630 --> 01:12:41.370
and just gets over her issues.
1542
01:12:41.810 --> 01:12:42.530
And that was the end.
1543
01:12:42.630 --> 01:12:43.510
It was like, what?
1544
01:12:44.070 --> 01:12:46.230
Like every time Brandy got involved in anything,
1545
01:12:46.230 --> 01:12:47.250
it just disappeared again.
1546
01:12:47.690 --> 01:12:48.450
It's terrible.
1547
01:12:48.570 --> 01:12:51.730
But at least they wrapped it up and it didn't just totally disappear.
1548
01:12:51.790 --> 01:12:55.530
She did have that little, you know, that scene with the therapist or whatever.
1549
01:12:56.890 --> 01:12:57.730
But yeah, everything.
1550
01:12:58.730 --> 01:12:59.850
Everybody's in a faction.
1551
01:13:00.190 --> 01:13:00.670
Yeah.
1552
01:13:01.030 --> 01:13:03.650
Trying to think Jericho's got the inner circle.
1553
01:13:03.650 --> 01:13:04.610
He has the inner circle.
1554
01:13:05.070 --> 01:13:06.510
They're like your traditional.
1555
01:13:07.230 --> 01:13:08.590
They have a tag team.
1556
01:13:08.590 --> 01:13:09.630
They got a bruiser.
1557
01:13:09.870 --> 01:13:12.450
They got like the young up and coming guy.
1558
01:13:13.390 --> 01:13:14.950
Sammy's the young and up and coming guy.
1559
01:13:15.090 --> 01:13:17.970
Hager's the he's just the muscle for Jericho.
1560
01:13:18.050 --> 01:13:19.940
And then you got Santana and Ortiz.
1561
01:13:20.750 --> 01:13:21.010
Yeah.
1562
01:13:22.090 --> 01:13:24.230
So that was like a more traditional thing.
1563
01:13:24.250 --> 01:13:27.170
But now with the whether it's the conglomeration,
1564
01:13:27.390 --> 01:13:30.330
if it's a Don Callis family, which has like 47 members.
1565
01:13:30.710 --> 01:13:34.370
But what I like about the Don Callis family having 47 members,
1566
01:13:34.390 --> 01:13:37.870
and this is where it's really funny because people will say
1567
01:13:37.870 --> 01:13:42.950
Don Callis family is the NWO of AEW, which is funny to say,
1568
01:13:43.230 --> 01:13:45.750
but I think it's a little better because one,
1569
01:13:45.770 --> 01:13:48.090
they're not all powerful like the NWO was.
1570
01:13:48.490 --> 01:13:48.610
No.
1571
01:13:48.610 --> 01:13:50.130
They're not always winning everything.
1572
01:13:51.070 --> 01:13:52.730
No, they're very fairly.
1573
01:13:53.390 --> 01:13:57.930
It's a bunch of it's a bunch of schmucks and like three top guys.
1574
01:13:58.410 --> 01:14:03.110
So like you have Andrade, Fletcher, Okada and Takeshta.
1575
01:14:03.130 --> 01:14:06.990
Those are the main members of the group and everybody else is kind of a schmuck.
1576
01:14:07.870 --> 01:14:12.650
Yeah, I mean, Brian Cage, you know, he's an impressive physical specimen.
1577
01:14:12.850 --> 01:14:14.330
He's not doing anything solo.
1578
01:14:14.670 --> 01:14:17.610
Lance Archer, good wrestler, not doing anything solo.
1579
01:14:17.790 --> 01:14:21.590
None of these guys are really going to ever be the world champion.
1580
01:14:21.750 --> 01:14:22.430
And they're not.
1581
01:14:23.010 --> 01:14:26.650
They're just kind of meandering out in the mid card somewhere.
1582
01:14:27.030 --> 01:14:30.010
At least they have kind of a purpose and kind of a,
1583
01:14:30.010 --> 01:14:32.590
you know, a combined something to work for.
1584
01:14:32.610 --> 01:14:36.050
Well, when it's clear that like you're one of the top guys,
1585
01:14:36.050 --> 01:14:38.470
everybody in the faction tries to help you.
1586
01:14:38.530 --> 01:14:42.510
You know, so like, yeah, Okada has the backup of everybody in the family.
1587
01:14:42.870 --> 01:14:46.150
You know, and I don't want to sound like I'm shitting on any of those guys.
1588
01:14:46.250 --> 01:14:48.230
I like all of those dudes.
1589
01:14:48.330 --> 01:14:49.350
You need schmucks.
1590
01:14:49.610 --> 01:14:50.830
You need schmucks in wrestling.
1591
01:14:50.970 --> 01:14:52.010
That's just the way it is.
1592
01:14:52.510 --> 01:14:54.930
The beauty of this is, I mean, again, the beauty of AEW,
1593
01:14:55.810 --> 01:14:57.970
their schmucks are really fucking good in the ring.
1594
01:14:58.490 --> 01:15:00.230
I like watching their schmucks.
1595
01:15:00.490 --> 01:15:03.210
We're getting some schmuck back in the chat over here.
1596
01:15:03.230 --> 01:15:03.570
We got here.
1597
01:15:04.130 --> 01:15:07.510
OK, Antoine says it's why when people compare AEW to Connecticut,
1598
01:15:07.510 --> 01:15:09.710
I go, no, this is more of a new Japan influence.
1599
01:15:10.150 --> 01:15:11.850
It's wrestling, not sports entertainment.
1600
01:15:12.070 --> 01:15:16.200
I like faction based because it represents to me what regular people would do,
1601
01:15:17.030 --> 01:15:18.270
which is have backup and friends.
1602
01:15:18.450 --> 01:15:19.390
Totally, totally.
1603
01:15:19.450 --> 01:15:22.710
Yeah, if you were in a business where you regularly got attacked
1604
01:15:22.710 --> 01:15:25.490
when you went to catering, you'd probably make friends.
1605
01:15:25.530 --> 01:15:26.110
Yeah, right.
1606
01:15:26.230 --> 01:15:27.310
It's kind of like prison.
1607
01:15:27.310 --> 01:15:28.090
It's like prison.
1608
01:15:28.110 --> 01:15:29.830
Right. It's run like a prison.
1609
01:15:29.830 --> 01:15:33.550
Blurry Line says Jericho had Inner Circle, Jericho Appreciation Society
1610
01:15:33.550 --> 01:15:35.490
and Learning Tree one out of three success rate.
1611
01:15:36.090 --> 01:15:40.690
I'm going to I'm going to I liked the Jericho Appreciation Society, to be honest.
1612
01:15:40.690 --> 01:15:45.270
They lasted maybe a bit too long, but I think ultimately they were all right.
1613
01:15:45.870 --> 01:15:48.070
But learning tree, I don't know what happened.
1614
01:15:48.390 --> 01:15:49.830
It was Jericho really reaching.
1615
01:15:50.130 --> 01:15:51.910
I was bad skewer universe.
1616
01:15:51.970 --> 01:15:53.450
I wish the pinnacle actually worked out.
1617
01:15:53.470 --> 01:15:58.270
So do I, because I thought they were and that it was MJF as I understand it back.
1618
01:15:58.450 --> 01:15:59.750
He didn't want to be part of a faction.
1619
01:16:00.150 --> 01:16:05.030
Well, but you know what, though, I don't blame him because people make MJO,
1620
01:16:05.030 --> 01:16:07.110
they make flair comparisons all the time.
1621
01:16:07.110 --> 01:16:09.830
And it's like, well, then why would you want to be in a stable with
1622
01:16:10.550 --> 01:16:12.710
the like the aren't until you have today?
1623
01:16:12.710 --> 01:16:15.170
You know, I mean, like I could see wanting to
1624
01:16:15.170 --> 01:16:18.250
distance himself from that kind of thing, you know.
1625
01:16:19.210 --> 01:16:21.550
See now DCF is not a faction that is a stable.
1626
01:16:21.650 --> 01:16:25.190
Well, if you remember my quote from earlier, every stable is also a faction,
1627
01:16:25.270 --> 01:16:26.850
but not every faction is also a stable.
1628
01:16:26.850 --> 01:16:32.530
So they and basically and basically what the Internet will tell you is
1629
01:16:32.530 --> 01:16:33.590
it fucking doesn't matter.
1630
01:16:33.590 --> 01:16:35.170
Everybody uses them interchangeably.
1631
01:16:36.290 --> 01:16:41.050
No, Antoine clearly was a little irked at us calling Lance Archer a schmuck.
1632
01:16:42.050 --> 01:16:43.370
I did call him a schmuck.
1633
01:16:43.570 --> 01:16:44.350
He's muscle.
1634
01:16:45.150 --> 01:16:46.810
Yeah, I like these muscle.
1635
01:16:46.850 --> 01:16:49.330
He loses when he wrestles and he's a muscle guy.
1636
01:16:49.590 --> 01:16:49.730
Yep.
1637
01:16:49.730 --> 01:16:52.050
He always loses and I always get excited to watch him
1638
01:16:52.050 --> 01:16:53.650
wrestle because he always has a good match.
1639
01:16:53.650 --> 01:17:00.530
Like Lance Archer had the greatest backstage, like action vignette of all time
1640
01:17:01.090 --> 01:17:05.990
in A.W.'s early days when he was like throwing guys into the ceiling and shit.
1641
01:17:05.990 --> 01:17:07.270
Do you remember that bit?
1642
01:17:08.030 --> 01:17:10.650
It was so he used to carry guys into the ring.
1643
01:17:10.650 --> 01:17:11.110
Yeah.
1644
01:17:11.110 --> 01:17:12.510
Oh, my God.
1645
01:17:12.830 --> 01:17:14.090
I mean, Lance Archer is a good monster.
1646
01:17:14.190 --> 01:17:18.630
I remember when Justin Roberts would go and chasing his opponent to the ring.
1647
01:17:20.230 --> 01:17:20.830
Right.
1648
01:17:20.830 --> 01:17:23.570
Yeah, I mean, he just didn't.
1649
01:17:23.710 --> 01:17:27.590
Lance Archer was missing that little magical thing that gets you over.
1650
01:17:27.750 --> 01:17:27.970
Yeah.
1651
01:17:28.030 --> 01:17:29.750
And Lance, look, Lance is almost 50.
1652
01:17:29.870 --> 01:17:32.390
I mean, he's he's, you know, and he's a big dude.
1653
01:17:32.570 --> 01:17:35.230
Being a big dude, it is hard to last in the business.
1654
01:17:35.410 --> 01:17:37.950
And Lance has been injured a lot in A.W.
1655
01:17:37.950 --> 01:17:40.930
And that's not surprising, you know, like at his age.
1656
01:17:41.410 --> 01:17:42.430
But here he is.
1657
01:17:42.430 --> 01:17:43.090
He's still going.
1658
01:17:43.210 --> 01:17:47.250
And I like when he shows up in his stupid sunglasses and he's sitting there like schmuck.
1659
01:17:47.410 --> 01:17:47.710
Oh, yeah.
1660
01:17:48.210 --> 01:17:52.270
Shit didn't remember when he had that match with mocks for the.
1661
01:17:53.550 --> 01:17:55.110
The U.S. title, the IWGP title.
1662
01:17:56.090 --> 01:17:59.610
And I think he beat him on he beat him for the U.S. title.
1663
01:17:59.770 --> 01:18:01.530
Yeah, he beat him for the for the U.S. title.
1664
01:18:01.550 --> 01:18:03.030
Yeah, in a in a Texas match.
1665
01:18:04.030 --> 01:18:07.830
Yeah, I mean, should guys guys, you know, he may have been a pay per view, I think.
1666
01:18:07.830 --> 01:18:08.490
I don't know.
1667
01:18:08.610 --> 01:18:11.610
In the early days, not he didn't quite main event, a pay per view,
1668
01:18:11.630 --> 01:18:13.130
but he wrestled Cody on a pay per view.
1669
01:18:13.150 --> 01:18:14.030
And he wrestled mocks.
1670
01:18:14.950 --> 01:18:15.990
Oh, I'm thinking Brody Lee.
1671
01:18:16.010 --> 01:18:16.610
That was Brody.
1672
01:18:16.610 --> 01:18:17.130
Yeah.
1673
01:18:17.350 --> 01:18:20.190
But mocks wrestled Lance right around that time as well.
1674
01:18:20.210 --> 01:18:20.550
Sure.
1675
01:18:21.030 --> 01:18:23.630
So Skewered Universe DCF is 100 percent stable.
1676
01:18:23.790 --> 01:18:26.190
Yes, they work together, but they also have individual goals.
1677
01:18:26.510 --> 01:18:29.670
And Don is there to help each of them achieve that to varying degrees of success.
1678
01:18:30.130 --> 01:18:32.930
What I love about the DCF is their goals.
1679
01:18:32.970 --> 01:18:34.350
They all have their own goals.
1680
01:18:34.690 --> 01:18:36.570
But Don has his own goal.
1681
01:18:36.570 --> 01:18:39.750
And that's the only goal he actually cares about, which is right.
1682
01:18:40.130 --> 01:18:42.910
You're all fucking marks to make me money.
1683
01:18:42.910 --> 01:18:49.290
And I will abandon you the minute you become inconvenient or you become in any way.
1684
01:18:49.810 --> 01:18:54.110
And he calls himself a high functioning sociopath over and over again.
1685
01:18:54.110 --> 01:18:54.630
Oh, yeah.
1686
01:18:54.730 --> 01:18:55.410
And he is.
1687
01:18:55.910 --> 01:18:57.630
If you get injured, you're dead to him.
1688
01:18:57.790 --> 01:18:59.190
You don't even exist anymore.
1689
01:18:59.410 --> 01:19:00.750
He just moves on.
1690
01:19:00.750 --> 01:19:01.410
Yeah, he just hates.
1691
01:19:01.830 --> 01:19:03.470
He hates you for getting hurt.
1692
01:19:04.770 --> 01:19:06.030
Don Callis family.
1693
01:19:06.150 --> 01:19:06.850
This is great.
1694
01:19:07.010 --> 01:19:09.650
Tony tried to make MJF flair when he wanted to be piped.
1695
01:19:09.870 --> 01:19:12.510
That's that's that's the quote of the day.
1696
01:19:12.510 --> 01:19:14.390
Flair comparisons all the time.
1697
01:19:14.390 --> 01:19:16.470
And it's just kind of I don't know.
1698
01:19:17.110 --> 01:19:20.190
The pinnacle had an amazing theme, which was a take.
1699
01:19:20.330 --> 01:19:22.970
It was a riff on the old horseman music.
1700
01:19:23.410 --> 01:19:24.130
Oh, no.
1701
01:19:24.230 --> 01:19:24.350
Sure.
1702
01:19:24.370 --> 01:19:25.450
Yeah, I wish the firm.
1703
01:19:25.610 --> 01:19:26.830
Who was the firm?
1704
01:19:26.890 --> 01:19:32.590
The firm was Stokely's group that had like Big Bill and like a bunch of people in it
1705
01:19:32.590 --> 01:19:35.130
that was going to take on MJF.
1706
01:19:35.450 --> 01:19:39.390
But the punk thing threw it into chaos.
1707
01:19:39.410 --> 01:19:39.910
Wow.
1708
01:19:39.910 --> 01:19:42.610
That's like it's kind of in the back of my head.
1709
01:19:42.830 --> 01:19:43.630
They were going to be.
1710
01:19:43.750 --> 01:19:46.070
I think MJF was going to be part of the firm.
1711
01:19:48.010 --> 01:19:53.890
And then CM Punk got injured and then did brawl out and that basically destroyed it.
1712
01:19:54.110 --> 01:19:56.170
Yeah, it was only a thing for like six weeks.
1713
01:19:56.630 --> 01:19:59.630
When Mark Davis and Josh Alexander are your muscles schmucks.
1714
01:19:59.630 --> 01:20:00.790
You have a pretty talented faction.
1715
01:20:01.050 --> 01:20:01.490
Totally.
1716
01:20:01.930 --> 01:20:02.370
Exactly.
1717
01:20:02.370 --> 01:20:03.830
Jake Doyle as well.
1718
01:20:04.130 --> 01:20:05.390
You know, yeah.
1719
01:20:05.390 --> 01:20:07.770
God, I can't wait for Doyle and Davis to be a tag team again.
1720
01:20:07.870 --> 01:20:08.350
Holy shit.
1721
01:20:08.350 --> 01:20:10.950
I that I was so excited for that team.
1722
01:20:10.970 --> 01:20:12.010
They were super cool.
1723
01:20:12.530 --> 01:20:15.270
And yeah, those two guys get excited every time they wrestle.
1724
01:20:15.270 --> 01:20:17.890
I mean, everybody in the Don cows family.
1725
01:20:18.330 --> 01:20:19.550
It's an amazing group of heels.
1726
01:20:20.030 --> 01:20:20.350
Yep.
1727
01:20:20.610 --> 01:20:20.770
Yep.
1728
01:20:21.130 --> 01:20:22.330
Yeah, I'm a fan.
1729
01:20:22.390 --> 01:20:25.030
Security Universe, when you hear Lance every now and then on commentary through
1730
01:20:25.030 --> 01:20:26.010
Don's mic, it's great.
1731
01:20:26.290 --> 01:20:27.570
Very much agreed.
1732
01:20:29.130 --> 01:20:29.570
Always never.
1733
01:20:29.630 --> 01:20:31.070
Lance just being the muscle is so cool.
1734
01:20:31.130 --> 01:20:32.510
I used to love him throwing dudes around.
1735
01:20:32.650 --> 01:20:36.670
Yeah, I used to love him running at the New Japan fans and they'd like they wanted
1736
01:20:36.670 --> 01:20:38.930
him to do it, but they would get terrified and run away.
1737
01:20:39.050 --> 01:20:39.870
It was so fun.
1738
01:20:40.090 --> 01:20:42.550
I can do an entire episode on the Don Callis family.
1739
01:20:42.730 --> 01:20:43.050
We could.
1740
01:20:43.770 --> 01:20:44.710
That's Alan's what says.
1741
01:20:44.810 --> 01:20:47.430
That's one of the reasons I say he's not a schmuck when he's in New Japan.
1742
01:20:47.430 --> 01:20:49.010
He does commentary and he's fantastic.
1743
01:20:49.930 --> 01:20:50.330
Agreed.
1744
01:20:50.510 --> 01:20:53.570
I say schmuck is a benevolent, loving term.
1745
01:20:53.930 --> 01:20:54.130
Okay.
1746
01:20:54.190 --> 01:20:55.050
He's he's just.
1747
01:20:56.050 --> 01:20:59.750
Maybe it would be better to say he's a guy that loses every single week.
1748
01:21:00.470 --> 01:21:02.110
And his job is to lose.
1749
01:21:02.350 --> 01:21:04.250
He's a guy who never wins.
1750
01:21:04.790 --> 01:21:05.790
He's a guy who never wins.
1751
01:21:06.170 --> 01:21:11.770
But his job is to lose and to make other people look really effing good when he loses.
1752
01:21:13.310 --> 01:21:19.230
And he is good enough that even though you know he's going to lose every single week,
1753
01:21:19.370 --> 01:21:24.210
whenever the guy who triumphs beats him, you go, God damn, that was a tough contest.
1754
01:21:24.710 --> 01:21:24.990
Yes.
1755
01:21:24.990 --> 01:21:27.110
Of course, you knew Lance Archer was not going to win.
1756
01:21:27.330 --> 01:21:30.130
Larry Line says the firm was how the devil MJF debuted.
1757
01:21:30.190 --> 01:21:34.730
So remember, they had that ladder match and all these guys came out.
1758
01:21:34.730 --> 01:21:38.590
And then the devil came out and he's like, I'm not going to show you who I am.
1759
01:21:38.590 --> 01:21:40.230
And he reaches up and just takes the chip.
1760
01:21:41.010 --> 01:21:41.850
That was right.
1761
01:21:42.230 --> 01:21:45.670
The firm was the ones holding the ladder for him and all of that.
1762
01:21:46.350 --> 01:21:50.350
Man, I barely remember that when he starts winning.
1763
01:21:50.810 --> 01:21:51.170
Yes.
1764
01:21:53.110 --> 01:21:55.690
So are we done talking about the Don Callis family yet?
1765
01:21:56.090 --> 01:21:59.470
We could potentially never finish talking about the Don Callis family.
1766
01:21:59.870 --> 01:22:03.930
Other other, you know, another group that's run by factions that I can't talk about with
1767
01:22:05.070 --> 01:22:08.090
nuance is stardom is completely faction based.
1768
01:22:10.530 --> 01:22:11.650
But let's move on.
1769
01:22:11.730 --> 01:22:16.550
Let's move on from more like historical perspective to like, who are the greatest factions?
1770
01:22:17.890 --> 01:22:19.690
Before we do the greatest, I want to do one thing real quick,
1771
01:22:19.690 --> 01:22:22.390
because I want to talk about modern factions and it does fit in.
1772
01:22:22.790 --> 01:22:24.490
OK, the four horsemen are together.
1773
01:22:24.570 --> 01:22:26.230
They say we're the greatest of all time, right?
1774
01:22:26.290 --> 01:22:27.690
We're going to win the world title.
1775
01:22:28.390 --> 01:22:32.550
Eventually, when what is it Windom and Arn and Tully, they win all the belts, right?
1776
01:22:32.550 --> 01:22:34.310
The US title, they get the tag title.
1777
01:22:34.590 --> 01:22:35.470
OK, Don Callis family.
1778
01:22:35.870 --> 01:22:36.350
We're a faction.
1779
01:22:36.730 --> 01:22:37.270
We want the belts.
1780
01:22:37.430 --> 01:22:37.930
We want the money.
1781
01:22:37.970 --> 01:22:39.690
We want the riches with the international belt.
1782
01:22:40.090 --> 01:22:41.130
We want the continental belt.
1783
01:22:41.250 --> 01:22:42.690
We want the world title, the TNT title.
1784
01:22:43.570 --> 01:22:47.410
All these factions, all these stables, all these groups get together and they want
1785
01:22:47.410 --> 01:22:51.690
to get all the belts, but they leave one belt out every time.
1786
01:22:51.990 --> 01:22:54.510
Why aren't there more women in stables?
1787
01:22:55.190 --> 01:23:00.150
If you have four men's titles and one woman's title, or most of the time you
1788
01:23:00.150 --> 01:23:06.090
have two, whatever, you could have four men and two women to go for the women's
1789
01:23:06.090 --> 01:23:11.150
belts, because if you want to truly get your stable over and say we are the
1790
01:23:11.150 --> 01:23:16.650
best and we want everything, you're like neglecting 50% of the population
1791
01:23:16.650 --> 01:23:17.270
of the planet.
1792
01:23:17.270 --> 01:23:17.650
Yep.
1793
01:23:18.890 --> 01:23:19.970
So that's all.
1794
01:23:20.150 --> 01:23:24.770
And I think Marina Strapier is going to be somebody who does that for
1795
01:23:24.770 --> 01:23:25.390
the death riders.
1796
01:23:25.390 --> 01:23:25.950
Go on.
1797
01:23:26.110 --> 01:23:28.930
Well, I'm talking about, you know, Medusa and the role she played in
1798
01:23:28.930 --> 01:23:29.750
Dangerous Alliance.
1799
01:23:29.910 --> 01:23:31.130
That was unheard of at the time.
1800
01:23:31.270 --> 01:23:32.630
It really was unheard of.
1801
01:23:32.690 --> 01:23:34.510
You didn't have that kind of crossover.
1802
01:23:35.530 --> 01:23:40.590
I think Sherry Martel is a very early precursor to all of that.
1803
01:23:41.310 --> 01:23:43.950
China, obviously, is where it kind of comes to a fruition.
1804
01:23:44.330 --> 01:23:46.510
And I think China is where it really becomes a thing.
1805
01:23:47.010 --> 01:23:53.490
And then I think, you know, you see it now, like in AEW, you have a
1806
01:23:53.490 --> 01:23:57.650
little bit of that where like, you know, the conglomeration has it.
1807
01:23:57.650 --> 01:24:00.410
Conglomeration willows technically in the conglomeration.
1808
01:24:00.730 --> 01:24:00.870
Right.
1809
01:24:00.870 --> 01:24:05.490
And then you have and you also have what's her name?
1810
01:24:05.670 --> 01:24:07.550
Zeta Steel is in sky flight.
1811
01:24:07.550 --> 01:24:07.970
Oh, right.
1812
01:24:08.030 --> 01:24:08.510
Yeah.
1813
01:24:08.570 --> 01:24:09.030
In top flight.
1814
01:24:09.070 --> 01:24:11.410
And I have a special place for top flight in my heart.
1815
01:24:11.510 --> 01:24:13.230
Hey, hey, good news.
1816
01:24:13.350 --> 01:24:14.090
Good news.
1817
01:24:14.830 --> 01:24:18.410
Don't say Martin got a haircut and he looks like an adult man.
1818
01:24:18.430 --> 01:24:23.870
Now he doesn't look like some weirdo who got his fucking finger
1819
01:24:23.870 --> 01:24:28.470
stuck in a light socket and like he's doing some Albert Einstein
1820
01:24:28.470 --> 01:24:29.310
tribute thing.
1821
01:24:29.650 --> 01:24:32.110
Like, I like Dante Martin, too.
1822
01:24:32.150 --> 01:24:34.310
But he looks like an adult man now.
1823
01:24:34.450 --> 01:24:35.210
It's great.
1824
01:24:35.230 --> 01:24:36.390
He looks like a little boy.
1825
01:24:36.650 --> 01:24:37.490
It really works.
1826
01:24:37.890 --> 01:24:38.410
Really.
1827
01:24:39.230 --> 01:24:43.850
I cannot express to you the difference it makes in his presentation.
1828
01:24:44.030 --> 01:24:48.110
He just really has a very short haircut now, and it looks great.
1829
01:24:48.870 --> 01:24:49.810
He's got a bit of a beard.
1830
01:24:50.570 --> 01:24:52.790
I got nothing but love for top flight, dude.
1831
01:24:52.790 --> 01:24:54.190
I think those guys are cool as hell.
1832
01:24:54.990 --> 01:24:55.630
Mm hmm.
1833
01:24:56.610 --> 01:24:58.970
Now I was sad when the rush went solo.
1834
01:25:01.170 --> 01:25:06.770
And they have mentioned crew as a still living thing,
1835
01:25:07.070 --> 01:25:10.330
and that they're like, we're not sure how this happens
1836
01:25:10.330 --> 01:25:13.550
to affect crew that Leo's this.
1837
01:25:15.090 --> 01:25:16.150
That's a cool.
1838
01:25:16.810 --> 01:25:18.770
That's the premier athletes.
1839
01:25:18.790 --> 01:25:21.510
The premier athlete story Denali is in the premier athletes.
1840
01:25:21.510 --> 01:25:22.130
That's right.
1841
01:25:22.390 --> 01:25:22.630
Yeah.
1842
01:25:22.630 --> 01:25:24.210
They are starting to do it.
1843
01:25:24.310 --> 01:25:24.510
You are.
1844
01:25:24.630 --> 01:25:24.910
That's true.
1845
01:25:25.030 --> 01:25:25.970
You're seeing more and more.
1846
01:25:26.090 --> 01:25:27.330
You're seeing a little bit of it.
1847
01:25:27.330 --> 01:25:30.790
I would like to see more of it and have it be taken to a bigger level.
1848
01:25:30.870 --> 01:25:34.150
Like on the card right now, you can pass them off and say,
1849
01:25:34.230 --> 01:25:35.670
well, they're kind of like valets.
1850
01:25:35.690 --> 01:25:38.930
So we need to see intergeneric wrestling, I guess.
1851
01:25:41.570 --> 01:25:44.650
I love that always never brought this up.
1852
01:25:44.690 --> 01:25:47.150
Imagine if we get the trios titles with Marina holding the belt.
1853
01:25:47.510 --> 01:25:50.310
I think the trios title should be the intergender titles.
1854
01:25:50.970 --> 01:25:53.750
Well, which underground had trios belts that were intergender?
1855
01:25:53.750 --> 01:25:57.090
I mean, the whole show was, but I'm pretty sure it was.
1856
01:25:57.090 --> 01:25:57.790
Yeah, totally.
1857
01:25:57.790 --> 01:25:58.830
It was the same thing.
1858
01:25:58.970 --> 01:26:00.090
But like, right.
1859
01:26:00.290 --> 01:26:02.630
I think that that's I think that that should happen.
1860
01:26:02.690 --> 01:26:05.670
Like I loved the trios matches where they had Willow
1861
01:26:06.730 --> 01:26:08.790
and whoever versus the death riders.
1862
01:26:08.870 --> 01:26:10.430
You know, those were fun matches.
1863
01:26:10.710 --> 01:26:12.710
Watching Willow spear the shit out of Wheeler.
1864
01:26:12.730 --> 01:26:14.330
You know, it was a lot of fun.
1865
01:26:15.930 --> 01:26:19.510
You know, Blair in line reference is one of the greatest endings
1866
01:26:19.510 --> 01:26:21.350
to a show of all time.
1867
01:26:22.130 --> 01:26:27.230
The one it was the arcade anarchy thing, right?
1868
01:26:27.430 --> 01:26:34.190
Where it's Kip Sabian and Miro and Penelope and versus.
1869
01:26:34.450 --> 01:26:39.510
And that's where we saw the day the re return of stat
1870
01:26:39.510 --> 01:26:44.530
as like an even bigger alien where she jumps out of the
1871
01:26:45.250 --> 01:26:46.630
out of the little pinball game.
1872
01:26:46.630 --> 01:26:48.650
She comes out of out of the.
1873
01:26:48.690 --> 01:26:50.090
Yeah, the claw machine thing.
1874
01:26:50.930 --> 01:26:54.150
So is that technically so is because I mean, the conglomeration
1875
01:26:54.830 --> 01:26:56.510
feel like grew out of best friends.
1876
01:26:56.850 --> 01:26:57.770
It kind of did.
1877
01:26:58.710 --> 01:27:00.990
So is Trent's mom in that group?
1878
01:27:01.050 --> 01:27:01.970
Is that a faction?
1879
01:27:02.110 --> 01:27:03.710
Is who was a member of chaos?
1880
01:27:03.810 --> 01:27:06.250
Technically, they all were members of chaos
1881
01:27:06.790 --> 01:27:09.790
because they had all been in Japan wrestling as part of chaos
1882
01:27:10.390 --> 01:27:12.670
for like a weekend or something.
1883
01:27:12.670 --> 01:27:17.050
So because Beretta was an honor, it was in chaos,
1884
01:27:17.590 --> 01:27:19.170
something like that, I think.
1885
01:27:19.610 --> 01:27:25.050
So Chuck Taylor and Statlander and Orange Cassidy and Sue
1886
01:27:25.050 --> 01:27:27.170
were all made honorary members of chaos.
1887
01:27:27.830 --> 01:27:28.470
Fantastic.
1888
01:27:29.710 --> 01:27:33.730
It is one of the greatest endings of a dynamite ever is when
1889
01:27:34.010 --> 01:27:37.870
the pixies are blasting and they're all up on the turnbuckles
1890
01:27:37.870 --> 01:27:41.510
and like the weird art kids won the wrestling show.
1891
01:27:41.510 --> 01:27:44.670
That was one of the coolest endings of all time ever.
1892
01:27:45.590 --> 01:27:47.370
Canonically, the trio's belt is mixed gender
1893
01:27:47.370 --> 01:27:48.610
because speedball is not buying.
1894
01:27:48.770 --> 01:27:49.570
Hey, there you go.
1895
01:27:49.590 --> 01:27:50.210
I like it.
1896
01:27:50.270 --> 01:27:51.690
I like it.
1897
01:27:51.870 --> 01:27:53.670
Yes, Okada acknowledged Sue as a member.
1898
01:27:53.890 --> 01:27:54.150
Yes.
1899
01:27:55.330 --> 01:27:58.710
So OK, now it's time to move.
1900
01:27:58.730 --> 01:28:00.290
Yes, sorry, I waylaid you.
1901
01:28:00.350 --> 01:28:00.950
No, you didn't.
1902
01:28:00.950 --> 01:28:03.730
That was an important point and I was not on my notes.
1903
01:28:03.790 --> 01:28:05.250
So thank you.
1904
01:28:05.530 --> 01:28:07.250
Greatest factions of all time.
1905
01:28:08.010 --> 01:28:10.410
So I took some time to think this through.
1906
01:28:11.090 --> 01:28:12.290
Not much time.
1907
01:28:12.590 --> 01:28:14.430
I will surely leave out some good shit.
1908
01:28:15.290 --> 01:28:17.850
But I, you know, I just listed the top five,
1909
01:28:17.970 --> 01:28:20.550
six that I think are the greatest and now we can debate.
1910
01:28:21.490 --> 01:28:23.830
The Four Horsemen still belong in that conversation.
1911
01:28:25.730 --> 01:28:30.220
The Heenan family, the WWF version,
1912
01:28:30.520 --> 01:28:32.320
the AWA version, whatever version like.
1913
01:28:33.280 --> 01:28:34.060
It's Heenan.
1914
01:28:34.140 --> 01:28:34.680
It's Heenan.
1915
01:28:34.920 --> 01:28:35.820
It belongs there.
1916
01:28:36.480 --> 01:28:41.400
The NWO, the Shield, Bullet Club.
1917
01:28:42.180 --> 01:28:43.080
And the Elite.
1918
01:28:44.040 --> 01:28:46.840
Those are like when I think of the greatest factions,
1919
01:28:46.860 --> 01:28:48.220
those are the ones I think of.
1920
01:28:48.820 --> 01:28:51.120
And yes, I left out a lot of really good ones.
1921
01:28:52.360 --> 01:28:53.700
But that's for you guys to fill in.
1922
01:28:53.800 --> 01:28:54.040
Degree?
1923
01:28:54.920 --> 01:28:57.740
I mean, I don't disagree with any of those.
1924
01:28:57.840 --> 01:29:01.160
I would put Dangerous Alliance in the place of the Shield
1925
01:29:01.160 --> 01:29:02.720
just because I like them better.
1926
01:29:04.100 --> 01:29:05.360
Are they more impactful?
1927
01:29:05.480 --> 01:29:06.180
Absolutely not.
1928
01:29:06.200 --> 01:29:08.480
I mean, if we're talking about impact on the business,
1929
01:29:08.820 --> 01:29:11.520
the ones you listed are pretty much like
1930
01:29:13.760 --> 01:29:16.860
the ripples in the pond that exploded
1931
01:29:16.860 --> 01:29:18.640
and you're still feeling it today.
1932
01:29:20.740 --> 01:29:23.220
Yeah, I mean, I can't argue with any of those.
1933
01:29:23.220 --> 01:29:25.500
Bleary Line says the Heart Foundation needs to be on that list.
1934
01:29:25.600 --> 01:29:28.500
They might be my personal favorite faction of all time
1935
01:29:28.500 --> 01:29:30.220
and I forgot to put them on the list.
1936
01:29:30.700 --> 01:29:32.300
And the thing that's cool about the Heart Foundation
1937
01:29:32.300 --> 01:29:34.520
is you have the Heart family,
1938
01:29:34.700 --> 01:29:36.340
which is Brett and all of his brothers.
1939
01:29:36.340 --> 01:29:38.120
And then you have the Heart Foundation,
1940
01:29:38.200 --> 01:29:40.380
which is Brett and all of his brothers-in-law,
1941
01:29:40.380 --> 01:29:42.520
which is just like a weird.
1942
01:29:42.680 --> 01:29:43.000
It's weird.
1943
01:29:43.800 --> 01:29:45.360
You know, Brian Pillman.
1944
01:29:45.560 --> 01:29:45.840
Yeah.
1945
01:29:45.980 --> 01:29:46.660
And Brian Pillman.
1946
01:29:46.720 --> 01:29:46.940
Yeah.
1947
01:29:46.940 --> 01:29:48.000
Are the Von Erics a faction?
1948
01:29:48.140 --> 01:29:50.460
Brian Pillman is like the dude that they all brought weed from
1949
01:29:50.460 --> 01:29:52.660
in the parking lot, you know, in high school.
1950
01:29:53.620 --> 01:29:55.280
The Von Erics are a family
1951
01:29:55.280 --> 01:29:56.960
because they are literally a family.
1952
01:29:57.220 --> 01:29:57.980
They are brothers.
1953
01:29:58.580 --> 01:30:00.660
And I would never consider them a faction,
1954
01:30:00.660 --> 01:30:02.660
but I mean, they won titles together.
1955
01:30:02.880 --> 01:30:05.140
They, you know, had a mission to keep
1956
01:30:05.140 --> 01:30:08.080
world-class championship wrestling clean and safe and everything.
1957
01:30:09.460 --> 01:30:13.280
Um, I wouldn't put them on my list of the greatest of all time, though,
1958
01:30:13.340 --> 01:30:16.000
but that's just an interesting talking point.
1959
01:30:16.200 --> 01:30:16.760
Go on.
1960
01:30:17.800 --> 01:30:19.740
Um, Antoine says, no, I can't count the elite.
1961
01:30:19.880 --> 01:30:21.860
I know what they did in ROH and AEW,
1962
01:30:21.960 --> 01:30:23.760
but the elite don't exist without the Bullet Club,
1963
01:30:23.780 --> 01:30:25.040
so I couldn't give them two spots.
1964
01:30:25.680 --> 01:30:27.620
I think they're distinctly different things.
1965
01:30:27.780 --> 01:30:32.360
I think that they're kind of their own culture with now in Bullet Club.
1966
01:30:32.360 --> 01:30:34.420
And then they became a completely separate entity.
1967
01:30:34.840 --> 01:30:36.360
So to me, they're there.
1968
01:30:36.380 --> 01:30:37.500
They are different things.
1969
01:30:37.500 --> 01:30:39.020
I know what you're saying, Antoine.
1970
01:30:40.480 --> 01:30:41.580
Yeah, I just.
1971
01:30:42.460 --> 01:30:45.000
I feel like the elite, it's like it is weird
1972
01:30:45.000 --> 01:30:47.120
because it's like I do kind of feel like they would have
1973
01:30:47.520 --> 01:30:49.700
probably would have existed without the Bullet Club.
1974
01:30:49.700 --> 01:30:51.300
But then again, maybe not.
1975
01:30:51.340 --> 01:30:52.360
Yeah, that's a good point.
1976
01:30:52.560 --> 01:30:53.340
Who's to say?
1977
01:30:54.360 --> 01:30:56.520
This is the episode where we just disagree with Antoine.
1978
01:30:58.420 --> 01:31:00.500
We'll have him on to say it to our face.
1979
01:31:00.700 --> 01:31:03.180
He won't have any problem saying it to our face.
1980
01:31:04.640 --> 01:31:06.700
But a good man who knows his wrestling,
1981
01:31:06.700 --> 01:31:07.660
that's for damn sure.
1982
01:31:08.080 --> 01:31:10.460
Yeti Malone says conglomeration because of Willow.
1983
01:31:10.700 --> 01:31:11.380
Fair enough.
1984
01:31:11.520 --> 01:31:13.380
I mean, that's all the reason you really need, right?
1985
01:31:13.480 --> 01:31:15.260
I mean, just what do you like the best?
1986
01:31:17.000 --> 01:31:18.260
They're actually like that.
1987
01:31:18.360 --> 01:31:21.460
They're a faction in the sense that they all kind of
1988
01:31:21.460 --> 01:31:23.940
come around one person who's the star and that's Willow.
1989
01:31:24.780 --> 01:31:27.300
Antoine says how the NWO ended in its real impact,
1990
01:31:27.440 --> 01:31:29.560
I have to say over the years has eroded my liking of them.
1991
01:31:29.920 --> 01:31:31.060
They led to a company ending.
1992
01:31:31.060 --> 01:31:32.920
I mean, in a way they did, you know,
1993
01:31:33.040 --> 01:31:35.640
Eric Bischoff's inability to think of anything else.
1994
01:31:36.280 --> 01:31:39.780
Yeah. Well, once it turned into a thing where,
1995
01:31:40.280 --> 01:31:43.100
like I said, you'd buy a video game and it didn't say WCW,
1996
01:31:43.120 --> 01:31:44.800
it said WCW versus NWO.
1997
01:31:45.060 --> 01:31:47.320
And it turned into like a Saturday morning cartoon
1998
01:31:47.320 --> 01:31:48.060
kind of thing.
1999
01:31:48.440 --> 01:31:49.520
G.I. Joe always fights Cobra.
2000
01:31:51.460 --> 01:31:52.920
Yeah, that just didn't.
2001
01:31:53.040 --> 01:31:54.960
It needed to have an ending, basically,
2002
01:31:54.960 --> 01:31:56.820
and it just never fucking did.
2003
01:31:56.880 --> 01:31:57.860
It just kept going.
2004
01:31:58.840 --> 01:31:59.480
And yeah.
2005
01:31:59.840 --> 01:32:02.800
And the band and all these other fucking.
2006
01:32:03.460 --> 01:32:05.620
I mean, if you're talking about
2007
01:32:07.400 --> 01:32:10.740
favorite factions, I would not put the NWO on my list.
2008
01:32:10.840 --> 01:32:11.680
I would put them on.
2009
01:32:11.740 --> 01:32:13.600
I mean, they're on the list of the most important,
2010
01:32:13.760 --> 01:32:14.300
the biggest.
2011
01:32:14.420 --> 01:32:16.440
Right. But they're not.
2012
01:32:16.540 --> 01:32:17.420
No, they're not really my favorite.
2013
01:32:18.780 --> 01:32:20.780
Blair Lyons said I kind of do agree where I have trouble
2014
01:32:20.780 --> 01:32:24.280
thinking of elite since as B.C. offshoots,
2015
01:32:25.440 --> 01:32:27.060
like, yes, like the dogs.
2016
01:32:27.260 --> 01:32:27.900
Yeah, yeah.
2017
01:32:27.980 --> 01:32:28.520
Bang, bang, gang.
2018
01:32:30.000 --> 01:32:32.180
Antoine, do the elite have to own every damn thing?
2019
01:32:32.300 --> 01:32:34.580
You elite lovers, like they're just perfect.
2020
01:32:34.580 --> 01:32:35.720
Perfect, perfect.
2021
01:32:35.720 --> 01:32:36.860
Well, I don't know.
2022
01:32:37.140 --> 01:32:38.180
I get it.
2023
01:32:38.400 --> 01:32:39.480
I get it.
2024
01:32:40.120 --> 01:32:42.060
But I love I love the elite.
2025
01:32:42.060 --> 01:32:43.480
I don't know what I can say.
2026
01:32:44.100 --> 01:32:45.280
But I do love them.
2027
01:32:45.300 --> 01:32:47.340
They brought so many people to wrestling.
2028
01:32:47.480 --> 01:32:48.580
I mean, at the end of the day.
2029
01:32:48.580 --> 01:32:50.540
And it's like it's weird because it's like almost
2030
01:32:50.540 --> 01:32:52.340
not even through just their wrestling.
2031
01:32:52.740 --> 01:32:53.520
Well, no.
2032
01:32:53.540 --> 01:32:56.280
And I mean, when I think it's the thing when
2033
01:32:56.280 --> 01:32:58.560
and I know that I've got this backwards,
2034
01:32:58.640 --> 01:33:02.080
but this is just my perception is when I think
2035
01:33:02.080 --> 01:33:04.320
of Bullet Club, I think of the elite.
2036
01:33:04.320 --> 01:33:07.000
Like, I think of that time period when they were
2037
01:33:07.000 --> 01:33:10.140
in the Bullet Club as being kind of prime Bullet Club.
2038
01:33:10.360 --> 01:33:12.400
Again, that's just my perception.
2039
01:33:13.300 --> 01:33:16.380
I know I think it's the longest period of time, though.
2040
01:33:16.620 --> 01:33:19.900
I think it's just that's what I that's you know what I mean?
2041
01:33:19.900 --> 01:33:21.920
Like, that's the era I think of.
2042
01:33:23.440 --> 01:33:25.500
So, I mean, yeah, I do kind of think of the elite
2043
01:33:25.500 --> 01:33:27.040
as being separate, I guess.
2044
01:33:28.020 --> 01:33:28.980
Yeah, yeah.
2045
01:33:29.580 --> 01:33:31.880
The Scare Glows historian proved me wrong.
2046
01:33:32.100 --> 01:33:33.600
After reading the Young Bucks book,
2047
01:33:33.600 --> 01:33:35.420
I think the elite would exist no matter what.
2048
01:33:35.460 --> 01:33:37.720
Yeah, I mean, they, you know, they they.
2049
01:33:39.940 --> 01:33:43.560
They they are it's just kind of a magical friendship
2050
01:33:43.560 --> 01:33:46.940
of Kenny and Matt and Nick and the four guys
2051
01:33:46.940 --> 01:33:48.520
in wrestling that don't do drugs.
2052
01:33:48.600 --> 01:33:49.300
Yeah, right.
2053
01:33:49.560 --> 01:33:50.040
Right.
2054
01:33:50.380 --> 01:33:51.760
We're going to end up saying man.
2055
01:33:53.140 --> 01:33:54.100
Yeah, yeah.
2056
01:33:54.440 --> 01:33:58.640
And and Cody just, you know, or a farming from the elite.
2057
01:33:59.820 --> 01:34:02.240
The elite, the elite.
2058
01:34:02.980 --> 01:34:03.940
Yes, absolutely.
2059
01:34:04.600 --> 01:34:08.320
OK, so let's move on to something that's a little better.
2060
01:34:08.480 --> 01:34:09.760
It's a little more fun.
2061
01:34:10.500 --> 01:34:13.500
Who are some of the fucking worst factions of all time?
2062
01:34:14.480 --> 01:34:15.360
I got a few.
2063
01:34:17.020 --> 01:34:21.020
I think you got to put Dungeon of Doom pretty high on the list.
2064
01:34:22.740 --> 01:34:24.860
It's not hot in here.
2065
01:34:30.610 --> 01:34:32.050
I I got to think.
2066
01:34:32.150 --> 01:34:34.570
I mean, I would have to put aces and eights at the all time.
2067
01:34:34.570 --> 01:34:37.490
Aces and eights is way up there, way up there.
2068
01:34:37.490 --> 01:34:38.910
They are definitely on the list.
2069
01:34:39.350 --> 01:34:40.790
Yeah, corporate ministry was.
2070
01:34:41.910 --> 01:34:45.970
Just like I I liked the undertaker with the goatee
2071
01:34:45.970 --> 01:34:48.570
and the Satan shit and like I like stuff.
2072
01:34:49.390 --> 01:34:52.910
That was just dumb putting them with the corporation
2073
01:34:52.910 --> 01:34:53.630
spirit squad.
2074
01:34:53.850 --> 01:34:54.590
I kind of like this.
2075
01:34:55.210 --> 01:35:02.050
I like the spirit squad ironically, but there it was not probably fun to sit through.
2076
01:35:02.230 --> 01:35:03.550
I wasn't watching it.
2077
01:35:03.610 --> 01:35:04.390
No, I wasn't watching.
2078
01:35:04.390 --> 01:35:07.930
So yeah, it was it's easy for me to say that I kind of
2079
01:35:07.930 --> 01:35:10.270
they're charming to me because I wasn't watching it.
2080
01:35:10.270 --> 01:35:12.950
I don't even remember who the welcoming committee is.
2081
01:35:14.430 --> 01:35:15.650
Who is the welcoming committee?
2082
01:35:16.970 --> 01:35:18.210
I don't even know who they are.
2083
01:35:18.210 --> 01:35:19.210
I don't even know.
2084
01:35:19.410 --> 01:35:21.250
I don't remember who Retribution is either.
2085
01:35:23.570 --> 01:35:25.810
Oh, oh, who is Retribution?
2086
01:35:27.370 --> 01:35:28.350
I don't know.
2087
01:35:28.590 --> 01:35:29.990
Maybe I just know the name.
2088
01:35:30.130 --> 01:35:30.690
I don't know what about.
2089
01:35:30.810 --> 01:35:32.010
What about MIA?
2090
01:35:32.170 --> 01:35:33.610
What about Misfits in Action?
2091
01:35:33.610 --> 01:35:35.510
Oh, dude.
2092
01:35:35.850 --> 01:35:37.710
Corporal Rection and like.
2093
01:35:37.970 --> 01:35:38.670
General Rection.
2094
01:35:39.190 --> 01:35:40.490
Yeah, General Rection.
2095
01:35:40.750 --> 01:35:42.430
Oh, Major Guns.
2096
01:35:42.950 --> 01:35:48.330
Let's take a bunch of dudes who are varying levels of because who else?
2097
01:35:51.190 --> 01:35:53.410
Chavo and who else was in that group?
2098
01:35:53.990 --> 01:35:57.030
I feel like Van Hammer was in it, even though I don't think he was around at that.
2099
01:35:57.290 --> 01:35:57.990
No, he wasn't.
2100
01:35:58.030 --> 01:35:58.870
It was Chavo.
2101
01:35:58.990 --> 01:36:02.290
It was Hugh Morris and it was Lash LaRue and Major Guns.
2102
01:36:02.290 --> 01:36:03.090
Lash LaRue.
2103
01:36:03.090 --> 01:36:04.810
And yeah, bro.
2104
01:36:06.150 --> 01:36:06.410
Yes.
2105
01:36:06.470 --> 01:36:10.910
So let's take people who are at various levels, you know, of the mid card,
2106
01:36:11.250 --> 01:36:15.970
give them an army gimmick that we kind of feel like is ripping off DX
2107
01:36:15.970 --> 01:36:18.970
and they all have stupid joke names.
2108
01:36:19.530 --> 01:36:24.190
No one is ever going to get over with a name Hugh G.
2109
01:36:24.230 --> 01:36:24.570
Rection.
2110
01:36:24.750 --> 01:36:25.950
You will never win a belt.
2111
01:36:26.190 --> 01:36:28.410
You will never be a legend in the business.
2112
01:36:28.650 --> 01:36:31.090
Ironically, he won the U.S. title as Hugh.
2113
01:36:34.310 --> 01:36:35.970
WCW was bullshit.
2114
01:36:38.590 --> 01:36:39.710
OK, OK.
2115
01:36:39.810 --> 01:36:40.610
Oh, that's right.
2116
01:36:40.770 --> 01:36:42.390
Retribution were the masked people.
2117
01:36:42.430 --> 01:36:46.990
Like it was like it was Mustafa Ali's thing.
2118
01:36:47.390 --> 01:36:50.170
And it was it was what was her name?
2119
01:36:50.310 --> 01:36:53.570
Mercedes Martinez.
2120
01:36:54.010 --> 01:36:56.010
Yes, Mercedes Martinez was in it.
2121
01:36:56.010 --> 01:36:59.440
And she literally said, could you guys just release me instead of making me do this?
2122
01:36:59.440 --> 01:37:00.580
Wow.
2123
01:37:01.980 --> 01:37:03.400
Props are her, you know.
2124
01:37:04.640 --> 01:37:05.940
But yes, retribution.
2125
01:37:06.220 --> 01:37:07.480
T-Bar and Mase.
2126
01:37:08.240 --> 01:37:08.840
Yes.
2127
01:37:09.680 --> 01:37:13.080
See, those are names like the Misfits in Action names.
2128
01:37:13.240 --> 01:37:14.520
They're just terrible.
2129
01:37:15.180 --> 01:37:15.920
Absolutely terrible.
2130
01:37:17.760 --> 01:37:20.500
MIA is somehow more childish than DX.
2131
01:37:20.500 --> 01:37:21.340
Yeah, yeah.
2132
01:37:21.480 --> 01:37:22.400
That's kind of what it is.
2133
01:37:22.460 --> 01:37:24.960
Because there's nothing clever or crafty about any of it.
2134
01:37:25.180 --> 01:37:26.180
It's just stupid.
2135
01:37:26.880 --> 01:37:29.880
What was the group that their name was sex?
2136
01:37:31.120 --> 01:37:32.680
That was in TNA, I think.
2137
01:37:33.100 --> 01:37:33.600
OK, OK.
2138
01:37:33.640 --> 01:37:34.180
And it was.
2139
01:37:35.400 --> 01:37:35.740
Right.
2140
01:37:35.880 --> 01:37:36.660
I think probably.
2141
01:37:37.040 --> 01:37:37.200
Right.
2142
01:37:37.340 --> 01:37:38.960
I feel like Bischoff was involved.
2143
01:37:39.120 --> 01:37:39.540
I mean, fuck.
2144
01:37:39.740 --> 01:37:42.980
There was the pretty mean sisters that was fucking PMS.
2145
01:37:43.600 --> 01:37:46.000
Oh, yeah, that was.
2146
01:37:47.180 --> 01:37:50.260
Jackie Jackie and Terry Terry Reynolds and me.
2147
01:37:50.380 --> 01:37:50.620
Right.
2148
01:37:50.700 --> 01:37:51.320
And me.
2149
01:37:52.340 --> 01:37:57.760
Stasiak, the son of former WWF champion Stan Stasiak.
2150
01:37:57.880 --> 01:37:58.240
Wow.
2151
01:37:59.080 --> 01:37:59.500
Yeah.
2152
01:38:00.460 --> 01:38:01.740
That's absolutely garbage.
2153
01:38:02.340 --> 01:38:03.480
Always never says I was watching.
2154
01:38:03.620 --> 01:38:05.740
Then I like the Spirit Squad because of their group move,
2155
01:38:05.840 --> 01:38:09.080
lifting up and slamming dudes and getting a little Dijkstra's leg drop.
2156
01:38:09.240 --> 01:38:10.620
And we are the Spirit Squad.
2157
01:38:11.160 --> 01:38:12.280
Nicky Nicky Nemeth.
2158
01:38:12.500 --> 01:38:13.320
They went in.
2159
01:38:13.540 --> 01:38:16.200
I mean, my memories of it is that they they went whole hog.
2160
01:38:16.240 --> 01:38:19.840
And that's like, if you're going to get anything over, you have to go whole hog.
2161
01:38:19.840 --> 01:38:22.680
So even if it's bad, sometimes that's kind of cool.
2162
01:38:22.860 --> 01:38:23.780
You know, yeah, it's wrestling.
2163
01:38:24.300 --> 01:38:25.520
The straight edge society.
2164
01:38:25.540 --> 01:38:28.540
That was, again, outside of my watch time.
2165
01:38:29.340 --> 01:38:30.260
I remember.
2166
01:38:30.480 --> 01:38:32.260
I know that what's her face?
2167
01:38:32.600 --> 01:38:34.720
Serena Deeb shaped her head in that group.
2168
01:38:34.740 --> 01:38:34.920
Yeah.
2169
01:38:35.260 --> 01:38:36.800
And Luke Gallows was in the group.
2170
01:38:36.860 --> 01:38:37.140
Yeah.
2171
01:38:37.260 --> 01:38:40.580
And it was like CM Punk was like a cult member kind of cult leader.
2172
01:38:41.400 --> 01:38:45.200
Yeah, I don't think I hated that, but I was kind of in and out at that point.
2173
01:38:45.260 --> 01:38:46.850
So I don't I'm not really sure.
2174
01:38:49.050 --> 01:38:51.450
Retribution with Mustafa Ali could have worked.
2175
01:38:51.690 --> 01:38:52.110
Yes.
2176
01:38:52.410 --> 01:38:55.130
I think most ideas in wrestling could work.
2177
01:38:55.210 --> 01:39:01.550
It's just they don't a lot of times because the people who came up with the idea are
2178
01:39:01.550 --> 01:39:03.090
idiots who don't know what they're doing.
2179
01:39:03.970 --> 01:39:04.470
Vince McMahon.
2180
01:39:05.130 --> 01:39:08.690
There's been besides the fact that it's utterly disgusting.
2181
01:39:08.870 --> 01:39:13.630
OK, to even suggest that Vince McMahon should come back to WWE in any form.
2182
01:39:14.290 --> 01:39:14.870
Yeah.
2183
01:39:14.870 --> 01:39:22.950
Anybody with nostalgia for Vince McMahon's booking is out of their fucking mind.
2184
01:39:23.730 --> 01:39:27.970
OK, well, if you think Vince McMahon personally wrote the bloodline, he didn't.
2185
01:39:28.150 --> 01:39:30.110
OK, that was Paul Heyman and Roman Reigns.
2186
01:39:30.630 --> 01:39:33.610
OK, like Vince had nothing to do with that.
2187
01:39:34.050 --> 01:39:35.590
And Hunter inherited it.
2188
01:39:35.750 --> 01:39:38.590
And both of them utterly suck without it.
2189
01:39:38.670 --> 01:39:44.210
And it's really no wonder that the bloodline seems to be coming back to WWE.
2190
01:39:44.210 --> 01:39:45.310
And they're going to ruin it.
2191
01:39:45.390 --> 01:39:45.830
You know, they're going to.
2192
01:39:45.930 --> 01:39:47.090
I think this bloodline silver.
2193
01:39:48.830 --> 01:39:49.230
Right.
2194
01:39:49.590 --> 01:39:51.530
No, I know it's bloodline 2000.
2195
01:39:54.210 --> 01:39:55.050
Thank you, Blair.
2196
01:39:55.190 --> 01:39:55.270
Line.
2197
01:39:55.310 --> 01:39:58.770
The welcoming committee were a women's faction of Natalia, Carmella, Tamina,
2198
01:39:58.950 --> 01:40:00.370
Lana and James Ellsworth.
2199
01:40:01.310 --> 01:40:04.530
They existed to welcome Charlotte Flair to Smackdown.
2200
01:40:04.530 --> 01:40:05.390
And it was fucking awful.
2201
01:40:05.970 --> 01:40:06.190
Yes.
2202
01:40:06.190 --> 01:40:06.850
Now I remember.
2203
01:40:07.010 --> 01:40:07.430
Thank you.
2204
01:40:07.450 --> 01:40:09.210
That is fucking terrible.
2205
01:40:09.810 --> 01:40:11.830
I'm not really a fan of James Ellsworth.
2206
01:40:12.610 --> 01:40:17.470
No, if you if you were familiar with the speaking out movement.
2207
01:40:17.470 --> 01:40:20.170
I was going to say the real man and the gimmick.
2208
01:40:20.170 --> 01:40:21.230
Yeah, the chinless wonder.
2209
01:40:21.310 --> 01:40:23.230
Yeah, fuck him in Laura.
2210
01:40:23.310 --> 01:40:27.330
Luke Gallows is Festus and Jesse had been drugging him to make him catatonic punk.
2211
01:40:27.490 --> 01:40:28.010
Got him sober.
2212
01:40:28.330 --> 01:40:31.550
OK, OK, that that makes sense that.
2213
01:40:31.650 --> 01:40:34.870
And that's a good way to get out of Festus, I guess.
2214
01:40:34.870 --> 01:40:35.430
You know.
2215
01:40:35.470 --> 01:40:35.870
Yeah, because.
2216
01:40:36.790 --> 01:40:40.350
Yeah, because I remember at the time thinking Luke Gallows was a decent wrestler.
2217
01:40:41.090 --> 01:40:42.450
You know, good enough.
2218
01:40:42.590 --> 01:40:43.310
Well, it guys.
2219
01:40:44.070 --> 01:40:45.650
So I'm sorry I interrupted.
2220
01:40:46.390 --> 01:40:48.630
No, I was talking about Luke Gallows.
2221
01:40:48.750 --> 01:40:52.310
You can you let me tell you some blade from this episode forward.
2222
01:40:52.350 --> 01:40:55.410
If I'm ever talking about Luke Gallows, you can interrupt me.
2223
01:40:55.410 --> 01:40:57.470
And I should I should interrupt you.
2224
01:40:58.710 --> 01:41:00.950
The scare glow, the oddities.
2225
01:41:01.010 --> 01:41:02.030
There we go.
2226
01:41:02.530 --> 01:41:03.330
There we go.
2227
01:41:03.490 --> 01:41:05.830
So they go from being the truth commission,
2228
01:41:06.390 --> 01:41:09.830
which is like a semi apartheid.
2229
01:41:11.070 --> 01:41:12.970
And Don Callis is involved.
2230
01:41:13.710 --> 01:41:14.890
He's the jackal.
2231
01:41:15.470 --> 01:41:17.390
And yes, Don Callis is involved.
2232
01:41:17.550 --> 01:41:20.370
I showed a friend of ours, a little stoned hobbit.
2233
01:41:20.510 --> 01:41:24.990
I showed her Don Callis from the 90s and she was like, what the fuck?
2234
01:41:25.150 --> 01:41:29.650
Like when with his luscious mane, like he's got the Bret heart hair.
2235
01:41:29.790 --> 01:41:31.370
You know, like, yeah, totally.
2236
01:41:32.410 --> 01:41:34.310
But anyway, so it goes from.
2237
01:41:34.310 --> 01:41:35.750
So before that.
2238
01:41:36.690 --> 01:41:37.910
It's the truth commission.
2239
01:41:38.010 --> 01:41:44.230
And before the jackal is there, it's this old dude who sounds mildly South African.
2240
01:41:44.270 --> 01:41:45.390
He looks like Colonel De Beers.
2241
01:41:45.390 --> 01:41:48.210
I don't think it is Colonel De Beers, but they're like,
2242
01:41:48.210 --> 01:41:51.350
basically a pro apartheid as a group.
2243
01:41:51.670 --> 01:41:53.850
Bowlby cannons in it.
2244
01:41:54.070 --> 01:41:55.930
Kurgan is in it.
2245
01:41:56.130 --> 01:42:00.110
And then the attitude error progresses and they go, you know what?
2246
01:42:00.110 --> 01:42:03.170
Throw the insane cloud posse with these guys and calm the oddities.
2247
01:42:03.170 --> 01:42:08.110
Also, John Tenta is back and he lost like 150 pounds and he's
2248
01:42:08.110 --> 01:42:09.710
in Luna and Luna Vashon.
2249
01:42:09.950 --> 01:42:11.650
Yes, I'm always a fan of Luna Vashon.
2250
01:42:13.550 --> 01:42:19.650
A buddy of mine who's in the comments often Kingpin brought up the idea of
2251
01:42:19.650 --> 01:42:20.870
he was fantasy booking.
2252
01:42:21.130 --> 01:42:23.950
What if the oddities would have had Raven as a manager
2253
01:42:23.950 --> 01:42:26.190
and been treated as a serious group?
2254
01:42:26.390 --> 01:42:29.390
And for a brief second, he did have me convinced
2255
01:42:29.390 --> 01:42:31.450
that it actually could have been something cool.
2256
01:42:31.990 --> 01:42:33.290
But were you higher?
2257
01:42:34.190 --> 01:42:36.230
No, I'm just easily influenced.
2258
01:42:36.430 --> 01:42:38.510
Listen, you talked me into doing a podcast with.
2259
01:42:38.510 --> 01:42:38.970
That's true.
2260
01:42:38.990 --> 01:42:40.090
I mean, that's true.
2261
01:42:40.170 --> 01:42:41.650
You are easily influenced.
2262
01:42:42.050 --> 01:42:45.770
The oddities did pretty much suck, but you needed a good guy team
2263
01:42:45.770 --> 01:42:47.470
to get their asses beat, I guess.
2264
01:42:47.510 --> 01:42:48.030
I don't know.
2265
01:42:48.030 --> 01:42:48.410
Yeah.
2266
01:42:48.410 --> 01:42:50.250
I have like a spot for the oddities.
2267
01:42:50.250 --> 01:42:55.690
I think the portrayal of them kind of as semi special needs people was.
2268
01:42:57.410 --> 01:42:59.990
Yeah, I kind of looked at him as like circus,
2269
01:42:59.990 --> 01:43:02.990
like sideshow people, which I guess is kind of the same thing.
2270
01:43:04.070 --> 01:43:05.950
But I wasn't making fun of them.
2271
01:43:06.050 --> 01:43:06.790
No, no.
2272
01:43:06.870 --> 01:43:08.990
But I mean, they were encouraging you to.
2273
01:43:09.130 --> 01:43:09.430
They were.
2274
01:43:10.070 --> 01:43:12.510
They were like they were the bridge to Eugene.
2275
01:43:12.610 --> 01:43:14.050
So, yes, I mean, yeah.
2276
01:43:15.070 --> 01:43:15.650
Oh, yes.
2277
01:43:15.750 --> 01:43:18.030
Blurry line, the Nexus and the Corey.
2278
01:43:18.190 --> 01:43:21.270
So there is a separate group that I had.
2279
01:43:21.710 --> 01:43:24.430
The reason I didn't name the Dangerous Alliance was because it was
2280
01:43:24.890 --> 01:43:29.050
the biggest misses, the factions that should have been huge.
2281
01:43:29.050 --> 01:43:31.590
And I would put the Nexus in there.
2282
01:43:31.630 --> 01:43:31.890
Yes.
2283
01:43:31.910 --> 01:43:35.890
And I would also say the biggest one ever was the Dangerous Alliance.
2284
01:43:37.270 --> 01:43:40.930
The Nexus is a group that like should have been.
2285
01:43:40.990 --> 01:43:42.150
They should have taken over.
2286
01:43:42.410 --> 01:43:42.950
They should have.
2287
01:43:42.950 --> 01:43:43.750
They were all.
2288
01:43:43.870 --> 01:43:46.750
They were literally all the up and coming stars.
2289
01:43:46.790 --> 01:43:49.470
Well, and at one point they had every belt except the world title.
2290
01:43:49.970 --> 01:43:50.370
Right.
2291
01:43:50.370 --> 01:43:52.210
And didn't John Cena beat them all in one night?
2292
01:43:52.210 --> 01:43:52.490
I'm sorry.
2293
01:43:52.510 --> 01:43:53.350
We're talking about the Nexus.
2294
01:43:54.390 --> 01:43:55.770
Oh, we're talking about the Dangerous Alliance.
2295
01:43:55.890 --> 01:43:57.570
Well, I went to Dangerous Alliance.
2296
01:43:57.630 --> 01:43:57.870
Sorry.
2297
01:43:58.430 --> 01:43:59.830
They come up, I get distracted.
2298
01:44:00.010 --> 01:44:00.390
What can I say?
2299
01:44:00.390 --> 01:44:02.910
I'm still looking at bleary lines comment because.
2300
01:44:03.130 --> 01:44:04.770
Well, because when you think about it, you had Wade Barrett.
2301
01:44:04.990 --> 01:44:10.650
You had a whole bunch of people that were good wrestlers that ended up going nowhere.
2302
01:44:11.290 --> 01:44:13.050
You had Heath Slater.
2303
01:44:13.310 --> 01:44:13.550
You had.
2304
01:44:13.710 --> 01:44:18.230
Well, how were they going to go anywhere when they all got beat by one guy in one night?
2305
01:44:19.030 --> 01:44:27.270
You have John Cena get DDT on a cement floor and then come back and beat two guys.
2306
01:44:28.390 --> 01:44:35.450
I can't fathom how anyone could have thought that was a good idea to have that happen.
2307
01:44:35.710 --> 01:44:39.370
And I don't know that anybody in the Nexus would have been the next big thing or whatever,
2308
01:44:39.370 --> 01:44:41.450
but like Jesus fucking Christ,
2309
01:44:41.450 --> 01:44:43.850
you cut their balls off before they even got into the ring.
2310
01:44:44.170 --> 01:44:44.630
You know.
2311
01:44:44.690 --> 01:44:45.010
Yeah.
2312
01:44:45.170 --> 01:44:46.110
That's bizarre.
2313
01:44:46.610 --> 01:44:46.870
Yep.
2314
01:44:48.270 --> 01:44:49.370
Lucha House Party.
2315
01:44:49.570 --> 01:44:52.230
I'm trying to remember Lucha House Party was it's.
2316
01:44:54.470 --> 01:44:56.530
Oh, they would do a somersault into the ring.
2317
01:44:57.270 --> 01:44:57.590
Um.
2318
01:45:00.010 --> 01:45:00.490
Callisto.
2319
01:45:00.550 --> 01:45:01.750
Yeah, maybe.
2320
01:45:02.550 --> 01:45:05.790
Yeah, I feel like it would have been Sin Cara Callisto.
2321
01:45:06.150 --> 01:45:06.710
Let's see.
2322
01:45:06.790 --> 01:45:08.990
But like not the original because the original Sin Cara was missing.
2323
01:45:09.170 --> 01:45:10.570
Yeah, he was gone by then.
2324
01:45:10.570 --> 01:45:11.990
Yeah, Lucha House Party.
2325
01:45:14.550 --> 01:45:17.870
That was Callisto Gran Metalik and Alince Dorado.
2326
01:45:18.510 --> 01:45:20.830
So, yes, I remember this now.
2327
01:45:20.870 --> 01:45:21.350
Yes.
2328
01:45:23.570 --> 01:45:28.850
Also, Gran Metalik, the guy who got a chance in AEW but didn't want to do any jobs.
2329
01:45:29.910 --> 01:45:32.690
So it didn't last very long.
2330
01:45:34.570 --> 01:45:37.250
Yeah, that's that's too bad.
2331
01:45:38.190 --> 01:45:39.650
Oh, Pippen Pippen.
2332
01:45:39.890 --> 01:45:40.470
Yes.
2333
01:45:41.090 --> 01:45:41.990
Fucking evolution.
2334
01:45:42.230 --> 01:45:47.170
We totally forgot about evolution, aka the four horsemen, too.
2335
01:45:47.610 --> 01:45:47.910
Yes.
2336
01:45:47.910 --> 01:45:49.030
And then leg.
2337
01:45:49.170 --> 01:45:49.470
No way.
2338
01:45:49.590 --> 01:45:52.470
And then legacy was with Ted DiBiase Jr.
2339
01:45:53.070 --> 01:45:54.930
and Cody and Randy.
2340
01:45:55.570 --> 01:45:56.430
That's evolution.
2341
01:45:56.650 --> 01:45:57.410
That's legacy.
2342
01:45:58.150 --> 01:45:58.950
That's legacy.
2343
01:45:58.950 --> 01:46:04.090
OK, sorry, but it was also I intentionally didn't mention evolution
2344
01:46:04.090 --> 01:46:07.010
because I think it's so overrated and garbage.
2345
01:46:07.450 --> 01:46:09.070
Like, yeah, I don't.
2346
01:46:09.250 --> 01:46:10.470
It got Batista over.
2347
01:46:10.530 --> 01:46:12.090
That's the only thing it accomplished.
2348
01:46:12.710 --> 01:46:17.210
It was just an excuse for Triple H to be the main guy on the show
2349
01:46:17.210 --> 01:46:19.710
and have some reason to justify it.
2350
01:46:21.390 --> 01:46:23.130
Not even just that.
2351
01:46:23.210 --> 01:46:26.370
It's just like, oh, I just really want to be in the horsemen.
2352
01:46:27.010 --> 01:46:29.930
It he really wanted to be Rick Flair is what he wanted.
2353
01:46:29.930 --> 01:46:33.570
And then he had Rick Flair trying to make him be more credible as Rick Flair.
2354
01:46:33.810 --> 01:46:34.250
Right.
2355
01:46:34.410 --> 01:46:37.250
And so, you know, it sucks so bad.
2356
01:46:37.590 --> 01:46:39.510
It was just dog dick.
2357
01:46:40.190 --> 01:46:41.130
Fuck that shit.
2358
01:46:42.470 --> 01:46:45.330
Pushing Randy Orton way too soon.
2359
01:46:45.570 --> 01:46:46.850
They gave him the world title.
2360
01:46:47.650 --> 01:46:50.770
Just so he'd be younger than Brock Lesnar when he won the belt.
2361
01:46:50.870 --> 01:46:51.070
Yeah.
2362
01:46:51.170 --> 01:46:53.470
And it was like Randy Orton was on this.
2363
01:46:53.650 --> 01:46:55.730
I mean, my God, I'll talk about this for years.
2364
01:46:55.730 --> 01:46:59.870
It's like he's on this uphill climb and everything's looking really good.
2365
01:46:59.870 --> 01:47:01.910
And it's looking like Randy Orton is going to be the man.
2366
01:47:02.810 --> 01:47:05.430
And then they gave him the belt so fucking early.
2367
01:47:05.490 --> 01:47:06.330
I don't know.
2368
01:47:06.430 --> 01:47:09.430
Again, I'm speaking for myself because obviously Randy Orton's had a pretty
2369
01:47:09.430 --> 01:47:12.110
storied career, but like it just killed him for me.
2370
01:47:12.110 --> 01:47:13.990
I just it was too quick.
2371
01:47:14.230 --> 01:47:17.310
I think Randy Orton has had a storied career, but it's kind of similar to
2372
01:47:17.310 --> 01:47:21.810
Charlotte Flair in the sense that he was given a historic career
2373
01:47:21.810 --> 01:47:23.810
before it even started, kind of.
2374
01:47:23.810 --> 01:47:28.070
And like he's a 14 time WWF champ, WWE champion.
2375
01:47:28.490 --> 01:47:30.570
But how many of those reigns do you even remember?
2376
01:47:31.010 --> 01:47:35.490
Like how many of those reigns felt significant or special in any way?
2377
01:47:36.390 --> 01:47:38.590
And because the belt hands every month for a while.
2378
01:47:38.630 --> 01:47:38.990
Yeah.
2379
01:47:38.990 --> 01:47:43.690
And I would say that him winning the title at that time actually set him back
2380
01:47:43.690 --> 01:47:48.810
because then people forget he's the baby face.
2381
01:47:48.810 --> 01:47:49.850
So he wins the title.
2382
01:47:49.870 --> 01:47:52.090
The next night evolution turns on him.
2383
01:47:52.090 --> 01:47:57.350
And then by WrestleMania, Triple H is the baby face and Orton is the heel
2384
01:47:57.350 --> 01:48:00.630
because the crowd had turned on Orton.
2385
01:48:01.490 --> 01:48:03.410
Just doesn't make sense.
2386
01:48:03.730 --> 01:48:06.010
Yeti Malone says Blade doesn't believe in evolution.
2387
01:48:06.230 --> 01:48:08.090
You've got Blade mixed up with AJ Styles.
2388
01:48:08.670 --> 01:48:11.150
Contextually, that could be true.
2389
01:48:12.470 --> 01:48:15.750
Yes, Evolution had one good match and it was like 10 years later
2390
01:48:15.750 --> 01:48:19.090
against the Shield because Shield's jobs literally depended on the
2391
01:48:19.090 --> 01:48:20.070
carrying them to a good match.
2392
01:48:20.130 --> 01:48:20.930
It's so true.
2393
01:48:20.930 --> 01:48:23.990
That the two matches they had were really, really good.
2394
01:48:23.990 --> 01:48:28.570
I will say that the corporate ministry was horrible.
2395
01:48:29.670 --> 01:48:30.710
Absolutely terrible.
2396
01:48:30.970 --> 01:48:32.250
Let's bring it back around.
2397
01:48:32.470 --> 01:48:34.290
It was me, Austin.
2398
01:48:34.430 --> 01:48:36.730
It was for me the whole time.
2399
01:48:36.870 --> 01:48:38.670
I remember WWEF.
2400
01:48:38.670 --> 01:48:42.290
I felt at that time had been on such a role like such a role.
2401
01:48:42.350 --> 01:48:45.650
And when it was Vince, that was the higher power.
2402
01:48:46.270 --> 01:48:49.350
I remember going like that is dog shit.
2403
01:48:49.350 --> 01:48:52.430
That was like just absolute horse shit.
2404
01:48:52.430 --> 01:48:53.790
It was a black scorpion move.
2405
01:48:54.010 --> 01:48:58.310
It was WWE's black scorpion move, which they proceeded to have
2406
01:48:58.310 --> 01:49:02.490
like seven or eight more of those over the next two, three decades.
2407
01:49:02.750 --> 01:49:03.290
Wasn't it?
2408
01:49:03.330 --> 01:49:05.810
I always hear the stories that it was supposed to be Christopher Daniels.
2409
01:49:05.810 --> 01:49:07.530
And I think he's backed that up.
2410
01:49:07.650 --> 01:49:09.090
I think it was supposed to be him.
2411
01:49:10.110 --> 01:49:13.330
Yeah, but I mean, I also heard Don Callis was a guy
2412
01:49:13.330 --> 01:49:14.870
that they thought could fit that role.
2413
01:49:14.870 --> 01:49:16.570
That'd been fucking cool.
2414
01:49:16.570 --> 01:49:22.070
Don Callis, like at full strength, leading, like having a huge role
2415
01:49:22.070 --> 01:49:25.110
in the Attitude Era, like that would have been crazy.
2416
01:49:25.730 --> 01:49:26.310
Yeah.
2417
01:49:26.850 --> 01:49:28.790
But Blurry Line does bring up a great point.
2418
01:49:28.850 --> 01:49:30.270
We're missing the worst one.
2419
01:49:30.330 --> 01:49:34.130
And I think it's a contender for the worst of all time.
2420
01:49:35.250 --> 01:49:35.990
The Authority.
2421
01:49:37.410 --> 01:49:38.570
Holy shit.
2422
01:49:39.810 --> 01:49:44.030
That's Hunter and Stephanie and the whole McMahon family.
2423
01:49:44.690 --> 01:49:45.890
Oh, they were called the Authority.
2424
01:49:46.650 --> 01:49:48.090
I guess I forgot.
2425
01:49:48.730 --> 01:49:50.030
I thought they were the corporation.
2426
01:49:50.670 --> 01:49:54.410
And well, there was basically, you know, they call it,
2427
01:49:54.410 --> 01:49:56.530
you know, the Attitude Era and the Ruthless Aggression Era.
2428
01:49:56.730 --> 01:50:01.990
But there's the McMahon Helmsley Era, which hangs over WWE for like 15 years.
2429
01:50:03.150 --> 01:50:06.390
And the reason why people quit watching the Authority starts
2430
01:50:06.390 --> 01:50:10.410
when Bryan Danielson beats John Cena at SummerSlam for the title.
2431
01:50:10.790 --> 01:50:14.290
Hunter turns on Danielson and Orton cashes in the money
2432
01:50:14.290 --> 01:50:16.090
and the bank on Danielson immediately.
2433
01:50:16.590 --> 01:50:18.610
Yeah, I was kind of in and out of some of that.
2434
01:50:18.870 --> 01:50:20.690
So I don't that's so that's why I don't.
2435
01:50:20.910 --> 01:50:26.070
And then Randy is he's the world champion, but he looks totally feckless.
2436
01:50:26.270 --> 01:50:29.810
Like he cannot hold this title on his own.
2437
01:50:30.430 --> 01:50:33.470
Like he can't beat Daniel Bryan.
2438
01:50:33.470 --> 01:50:36.070
They wrestle at three consecutive pay per views, I think.
2439
01:50:36.670 --> 01:50:37.750
And yeah, I don't know.
2440
01:50:37.910 --> 01:50:41.450
Danielson wins once and then they take the belt away from him on Raw.
2441
01:50:42.010 --> 01:50:46.130
One of the matches ends a pay per view ended in a no contest.
2442
01:50:46.570 --> 01:50:51.790
Main event because Big Show shows up and knocks everybody out.
2443
01:50:52.670 --> 01:50:55.770
And it's only because there wasn't competition
2444
01:50:55.770 --> 01:50:58.590
that this company was allowed to keep going.
2445
01:50:58.610 --> 01:51:01.890
And then the Authority continues into Roman's push,
2446
01:51:01.890 --> 01:51:04.050
which is what they were trying to get to the whole time.
2447
01:51:05.130 --> 01:51:07.770
And yeah, this is all like kind of vague.
2448
01:51:08.010 --> 01:51:11.850
It's like Hunter enters the so Roman gets forced to defend
2449
01:51:11.850 --> 01:51:15.790
the WWE world title in the Royal Rumble.
2450
01:51:16.910 --> 01:51:19.930
Oh, and that's when Triple H one he has to enter at number one.
2451
01:51:20.590 --> 01:51:21.050
Right.
2452
01:51:21.090 --> 01:51:22.650
And Triple H enters at number 30.
2453
01:51:23.310 --> 01:51:23.810
Right.
2454
01:51:24.050 --> 01:51:29.130
And throws Roman out at 28 and then throws Ambrose out at 29
2455
01:51:29.130 --> 01:51:31.970
because just for a minute, it looked like Dean Ambrose might win.
2456
01:51:31.990 --> 01:51:33.750
And the crowd wanted it so bad.
2457
01:51:34.970 --> 01:51:40.630
But yeah, and then Hunter defends the world title against Roman
2458
01:51:41.630 --> 01:51:47.730
at 32 in Dallas at the Jerry World in front of, you know,
2459
01:51:47.770 --> 01:51:50.710
what they're saying is 90 some odd thousand people,
2460
01:51:50.730 --> 01:51:52.430
which it wasn't the real number.
2461
01:51:53.990 --> 01:51:57.890
And the crowd is cheering for Triple H because they don't want Roman that much.
2462
01:51:59.790 --> 01:52:01.210
They're cheering for Triple H.
2463
01:52:01.270 --> 01:52:04.010
That's the only time he's ever been cheered organically in his life.
2464
01:52:05.370 --> 01:52:05.890
Yeah.
2465
01:52:06.630 --> 01:52:11.090
AJ security, Seth Rollins as the champion was the champion for the authority.
2466
01:52:12.670 --> 01:52:13.210
It's so bad.
2467
01:52:13.710 --> 01:52:13.830
Yeah.
2468
01:52:13.830 --> 01:52:13.970
Yeah.
2469
01:52:13.990 --> 01:52:18.870
I kind of remember that stuff happening, but you have good trauma response.
2470
01:52:19.210 --> 01:52:20.630
You have blocked it out.
2471
01:52:21.290 --> 01:52:22.350
You just blocked it out.
2472
01:52:22.730 --> 01:52:23.650
We too.
2473
01:52:23.910 --> 01:52:24.350
Yeah.
2474
01:52:24.350 --> 01:52:24.850
There you go.
2475
01:52:24.930 --> 01:52:27.710
The weed and see, that's right around where I stopped smoking weed.
2476
01:52:27.730 --> 01:52:30.570
And I think you can tell because I remember way too much of it.
2477
01:52:31.510 --> 01:52:33.290
I'm glad you got clean and sober.
2478
01:52:33.290 --> 01:52:36.290
He was I could have picked a better time.
2479
01:52:36.290 --> 01:52:37.230
That's for sure.
2480
01:52:37.410 --> 01:52:41.750
It must have been really extra challenging during that time period.
2481
01:52:42.250 --> 01:52:42.450
Yes.
2482
01:52:42.450 --> 01:52:49.050
And then the authority quote unquote ends in tooth at the end of 2018.
2483
01:52:51.370 --> 01:52:56.470
The McMahons all show up on TV and it's Triple H and Stephanie and Vince and Shane.
2484
01:52:56.910 --> 01:53:00.890
And they're like, look, we know the show hasn't been any good.
2485
01:53:01.530 --> 01:53:01.990
Yeah.
2486
01:53:01.990 --> 01:53:04.610
We know you fans deserve better.
2487
01:53:05.650 --> 01:53:07.710
You are the authority now.
2488
01:53:08.410 --> 01:53:12.090
And then we're everybody's like, what the fuck is going on?
2489
01:53:13.110 --> 01:53:17.750
And a week later, they announced all elite wrestling a week later.
2490
01:53:17.970 --> 01:53:22.230
So they knew that was coming and they're like, we know we suck.
2491
01:53:22.390 --> 01:53:22.950
We're terrible.
2492
01:53:23.110 --> 01:53:23.510
We suck.
2493
01:53:23.710 --> 01:53:24.150
Oh my God.
2494
01:53:24.730 --> 01:53:28.450
And it's so funny because for years after this, if you got into an argument
2495
01:53:28.450 --> 01:53:33.130
with somebody online, they'd be like, oh, Vince is Vince is like a real boss,
2496
01:53:33.130 --> 01:53:33.610
like whatever.
2497
01:53:33.730 --> 01:53:37.810
It's like he was shitting his pants in public the entire time
2498
01:53:37.810 --> 01:53:39.790
about the idea of competition.
2499
01:53:40.430 --> 01:53:41.110
Oh, shit.
2500
01:53:41.190 --> 01:53:43.390
Somebody's going to show him what real wrestling is.
2501
01:53:43.470 --> 01:53:44.350
Yeah, no.
2502
01:53:45.570 --> 01:53:47.850
So, yeah, the authority.
2503
01:53:48.050 --> 01:53:49.110
Yes, we were the authority.
2504
01:53:49.190 --> 01:53:52.110
But what was funny was to me brought that up.
2505
01:53:53.450 --> 01:53:55.230
Is it Joe Blair line?
2506
01:53:55.330 --> 01:53:55.650
Yes.
2507
01:53:56.170 --> 01:53:56.330
Yes.
2508
01:53:56.330 --> 01:53:57.630
Fuck you for making me remember that.
2509
01:53:58.530 --> 01:53:59.530
It's not right.
2510
01:53:59.870 --> 01:54:00.670
It's not right.
2511
01:54:01.410 --> 01:54:01.770
What the?
2512
01:54:01.890 --> 01:54:02.650
Blair has more.
2513
01:54:02.830 --> 01:54:05.690
What the fuck was the name of Jinder's faction with the Bollywood boys and Kali?
2514
01:54:05.750 --> 01:54:07.170
I don't even remember.
2515
01:54:07.950 --> 01:54:13.150
Oh, real Americans with Dutch Mantel, Jack Swagger, Claudio and Alberto.
2516
01:54:13.830 --> 01:54:15.730
Oh, I have them on here.
2517
01:54:15.790 --> 01:54:23.450
Actually, the League of Nations with Del Rio, Rusev, Seamus.
2518
01:54:24.250 --> 01:54:25.890
They were all against Roman.
2519
01:54:25.890 --> 01:54:30.010
This was the feud before the Royal Rumble thing.
2520
01:54:30.570 --> 01:54:31.290
The League of Nations.
2521
01:54:31.650 --> 01:54:31.970
Yes.
2522
01:54:32.330 --> 01:54:32.970
Yes.
2523
01:54:33.490 --> 01:54:35.690
Also, they split off the League of Nations.
2524
01:54:36.410 --> 01:54:36.490
Yes.
2525
01:54:37.550 --> 01:54:42.610
And then we, the people thing, which became babyface them at some point,
2526
01:54:42.610 --> 01:54:46.670
which was actually based around the Tea Party anti-immigrant thing.
2527
01:54:47.270 --> 01:54:48.250
Oh, my God.
2528
01:54:48.870 --> 01:54:51.030
Oh, my God.
2529
01:54:51.390 --> 01:54:52.330
So bad.
2530
01:54:52.330 --> 01:54:53.130
It's horrible.
2531
01:54:53.310 --> 01:54:53.890
It's horrible.
2532
01:54:53.890 --> 01:54:55.830
So I had the League of Nations in here.
2533
01:54:55.910 --> 01:55:02.170
The only other one that I didn't mention in worst was the WCW ECW Alliance.
2534
01:55:03.950 --> 01:55:10.470
The fake NWO that had no stars that they actually had to have Steve Austin come over
2535
01:55:10.470 --> 01:55:15.210
and lead because they were going nowhere because they refused to actually sign.
2536
01:55:15.450 --> 01:55:15.930
Yes.
2537
01:55:16.010 --> 01:55:18.710
The Glenn Beck faction, as Blair line points out.
2538
01:55:18.730 --> 01:55:20.170
That's a perfect way to put it.
2539
01:55:21.130 --> 01:55:21.950
My God.
2540
01:55:22.590 --> 01:55:26.690
You know, it really does show how much social media has changed wrestling
2541
01:55:26.690 --> 01:55:31.690
because you would never do a we the people thing now or a real Americans thing now.
2542
01:55:32.070 --> 01:55:34.550
But at the time, that was he, right?
2543
01:55:34.730 --> 01:55:36.930
And I would just read Terry Funk's autobiography.
2544
01:55:36.930 --> 01:55:40.790
He was talking about the utility of race angles and how they can be great.
2545
01:55:41.930 --> 01:55:43.910
Because that was the thought process.
2546
01:55:44.070 --> 01:55:46.150
But that was how people thought back then.
2547
01:55:46.150 --> 01:55:49.590
And his whole thing was it wouldn't work now.
2548
01:55:49.590 --> 01:55:51.670
And this was 2005, mind you.
2549
01:55:51.950 --> 01:55:53.530
So he's saying it wouldn't work now.
2550
01:55:53.530 --> 01:55:57.170
You don't need to do it now because racism isn't a problem anymore.
2551
01:55:57.590 --> 01:55:59.230
But oh, yeah, yeah.
2552
01:55:59.230 --> 01:56:02.870
But he was saying the whole point of a race angle is so that
2553
01:56:02.870 --> 01:56:05.150
the white guy gets his ass kicked at the end.
2554
01:56:05.310 --> 01:56:12.570
And, you know, you kind of like use that to normalize black people being equal.
2555
01:56:12.810 --> 01:56:14.690
The person of color is the face, right?
2556
01:56:14.950 --> 01:56:20.590
The downtrodden is the face and the heel, the evil rich white guy gets their comeuppance.
2557
01:56:20.590 --> 01:56:23.570
Just like that time that Triple H feuded with Booker T.
2558
01:56:23.910 --> 01:56:24.910
Oh, wait, cool.
2559
01:56:25.130 --> 01:56:27.110
Well, until next time, I'm Professor Degree.
2560
01:56:27.310 --> 01:56:28.570
This is iBlade Daily.
2561
01:56:29.330 --> 01:56:30.990
And this is Pro Wrestling Forever.
2562
01:56:31.190 --> 01:56:34.350
Pro Wrestling in all forms, for all people, for all time.